"I play the way I want" -Randomperson

[Ghishlain]

Seeing as you're most likely not paying their subscription or have any sort of digital or real world ties with that person, it shouldn't matter.

In the same token, they are not paying for my subscription either. However, they are hampering my enjoyment of the game by playing the way they are playing because we might be wiping over and over again to the same boss and the person in question may be the direct cause of this wiping. Is it fair to myself that someone else, who isn't paying for my subscription, be hampering my enjoyment of the game? The coin can be flipped both ways in this regard. We're playing an MMO here, there should be a general level of respect and good play for the enjoyment of everyone we play with.

Criticizing a person in-game in a dungeon due to expectations can lead the experience from going from bad to extremely horrible. If you wanna risk it by "giving your 2 cents" go ahead I wont stop you. Yet if it doesn't end up the way you wanted then one should realize that they made the situation worse and trying to play the blame game doesn't help. They are both at fault from my point of view.

You are making the assumption here that I present myself in a negative light when I offer my help to other individuals.

-In my AV example previous, I was in that AV with a PLD and BLM both from my FC. We said nothing to the BLM, we made a comment about the BLMs playstyle in FC chat, but ignore the individual because we knew we could carry the BLM to victory. No words of ire arose from anyone.

-In a Pharos Sirious I had for DR, I was with a BLM who wasn't quite sure how to do his BLM rotation. He always was going from Fire to Ice half way through and never really throwing out any significant damage. I noticed he was also wearing AF mostly and seemed new to the 50 scene in general. I politely asked him "I noticed you're a new 50 BLM, would you like any help with your rotation?" He answered with a courteous yes and I gave him a few pointers. His rotation was still a mish-mash of buttons at times, but he was learning, and that's the important bit of the lesson.

-Generally, when someone mentions they are new for a a dungeon at the beginning, I make a point to state I can give them a few pointers when we get to the bosses (or any particular mob of note). We get to the boss, I usually run off 3-4 points to look out for without being prompted, and then we engage. No irksome words are exchanged.

HOWEVER, I will agree that many individuals do present themselves in a less than ideal light and this causes further strife and ire to be brought forward from both parties. In this particular case, yes, I agree, both parties are at fault. But your assumption that all "advice giving" leads to altercation is false. Just it "mostly does" given the negativity / elitism that many individuals have.

not if they have marc/evil druid cards :3

Mmm, the power of Unfrozen Water Armour on a VIT built Scholar was so fun. Jupital Thunder, eat your heart out. And then swapping to an Evil Druid Silk Robe to deal with other pesky Scholars =DDD Ah, the memories ~Wistfully remembers~

[Hyrist]

There's no clear black and white circumstance. Approaching the subject with the smallest sliver of information only results in the absolute worst and polarized opinions, which happens in the majority of these forum discussions, unfortunately.

Generally speaking, I am of the opinion that when it comes to a teamwork activity, you behave as a member of a team. If you are acting purposefully contrary to what is needed of you as a team member, then it is best for the team that you are not a part of it.

However, part of the journey of finding enjoyment in a team-based game like MMORPGs, is finding a team that often agrees with your playstyle and sensibilities. And, sadly, FFXIV really does lack a bit in the team building department. (Though the players seem to do their best with what they have.)

If you find yourself contrary to the games core mechanics, than perhaps the game itself might not be for you. Currently, FFXIV isn't exactly forgiving as far as playstyle flexibility. Hopefully this will be a little less imposing in the future as more Classes begin to get their secondary jobs. But eccentric or unconventional playstyles will most often be looked upon poorly, regardless of the intentions, for good or ill, of the players critiquing it.

In the end, playing the way you want shouldn't be done at the expense of others. It's about putting forth an offering of goodwill to your fellow adventurers. Be courteous, and part of that is be responsible for the role you accepted when stepping into a random group. But being courteous is a responsibility for all players, not just the one who may seem to be lagging behind in performance. Too often we forget these things in the heat of the moment.

If something seems wrong, be sure it's not with anger you communicate with, but with concern. Otherwise you are purposefully spoiling the pastime of someone else, the very same grievance you're letting yourself become angry over.

[Gormogon]

You are making the assumption here that I present myself

Before you go and jump to conclusions, I used "you" in a "general" manner. I didn't use "you" to mean specifically you.

[Noshpan]

I don't use parsers for this game. But I can watch another Black Mage, or I can watch a Dragoon, and be able to discern their performance. Though I am currently leveling Summoner, I am learning from observing the performance of other Summoners in the group.

[Irving]

Seeing as you're most likely not paying their subscription or have any sort of digital or real world ties with that person, it shouldn't matter.

Criticizing a person in-game in a dungeon due to expectations can lead the experience from going from bad to extremely horrible. If you wanna risk it by "giving your 2 cents" go ahead I wont stop you. Yet if it doesn't end up the way you wanted then one should realize that they made the situation worse and trying to play the blame game doesn't help. They are both at fault from my point of view.

It should definitely matter as any person who joins into a dungeon is expected by the majority to pull their own weight. No one is saying said person should be perfect and perform within the upper echelon of players. Most of the people in here are saying that some baseline performance should be expected.

I will agree that people will often voice their criticism rather poorly and it can make a bad situation worse. Expressing advice and criticism this way can indeed be very damaging however it should not be an excuse to initiate destructive behavior as Kimikryo stated in his original post.

Let us remember, however, that while we are not paying said persons subscription fees or have any ties with the person, that they are not paying ours or the other members of the party. Due to such, I do not feel it is wrong for the majority of the party to voice their opinion as long as its voiced and expressed correctly. I also believe its proper to offer help and advice to others so they can better learn the intricacies of their desired job and thus allow them to better contribute to the group they are actively taking part in.

Unfortunately a lot of this ultimately depends on how people express themselves to one another and how one interprets these expressions so the best of intentions can be seen as the worst of insults.

Hyrist put it perfectly.

In the end, playing the way you want shouldn't be done at the expense of others. It's about putting forth an offering of goodwill to your fellow adventurers. Be courteous, and part of that is be responsible for the role you accepted when stepping into a random group. But being courteous is a responsibility for all players, not just the one who may seem to be lagging behind in performance. Too often we forget these things in the heat of the moment.

[Blackcanary]

The fact that they are paying the monthly fee if they want to play that way they can. Your not paying their fee for them so suck it up and deal with it, no need to make a damn stupid thread about it. Get a bloody grip on life its just a game. Looks like someone is having a moment lmao.

[Schaeffa]

I was healing Haukke Manor HM last night and got a response like this from the DRG who didn't want to move out of AoEs or focus adds on the last boss.
DRG:"I play how I want. I want to keep damaging the boss."
Tank:"You will do more damage if you aren't terrored from Dark Mist."
DRG:"But I don't want to move."
I decided healing/raising him was a waste of my MP, so I let him die.
DRG:"Raise, plz"
Me:"I play how I want. I want to keep you dead."
After that wipe, he finally took the hint and started dodging and focusing adds. He just needed some tough love—I got three commendations when we finally managed to end the dungeon. =)

[Ghishlain]

Before you go and jump to conclusions, I used "you" in a "general" manner. I didn't use "you" to mean specifically you.

Before you go and jump to conclusions, I suggest you be careful whom you quote and how you respond to said quote

With that snarky-ness aside, I don't fully agree with your statement, nor do I fully disagree with your statement. I think I stated my points quite clearly in the last few posts, so I shall leave it at we shall agree to disagree and let others formulate their opinions based on the discussion.

[zeth07]

The fact that they are paying the monthly fee if they want to play that way they can. Your not paying their fee for them so suck it up and deal with it, no need to make a damn stupid thread about it. Get a bloody grip on life its just a game. Looks like someone is having a moment lmao.

As a DRG I've seen other lv.50 DRGs never do the Chaos Thrust combo, both times I've said "how come you aren't doing the Chaos Thrust combo?" and never got a response. I don't really like the situation of people using 3rd party stuff and this is an obvious example of when you don't need one to see if a person isn't doing their job up to par , you can see the skills on the mob besides just seeing the animations themselves.

[NorthernLadMSP]

DRG:"Raise, plz"
Me:"I play how I want. I want to keep you dead."
After that wipe, he finally took the hint and started dodging and focusing adds. He just needed some tough love—I got three commendations when we finally managed to end the dungeon. =)

LMAO, OMG I love it. You win post of the day.