Compilation: Capped Dungeons, pro and contra arguments

[Rinsui]

@Rentahamster
正直に言うと、貴方の立場がとても良く分かります。特に、現在の仕組みではR１５等でも、他クラスのアビリが使えるなのではないでしょうか。と言うのは、別にマクロを修正しなくても。。。（笑）。が、一応、低レベルで余り意味・効果が無いアビリをアビリバーから処分したい方も居ると思われます。その仕事を「マイナー」と定義しても、論争の相手は納得できないと思うのではないでしょうか。

[Rentahamster]

okie dokie

[Chinook]

Just to make things clearer:

So the original statement was:

Human nature makes people ALWAYS choose the easiest and most effective path.

Procap people believe in this, and pro-uncap people do not.

That's simply not true. And logically, it cannot be true.

Believing such a statement creates the folowing:

Capped dungeon : Use of strategies and cooperation to beat it in the easiest and most efficient way

Uncapped dungeon : Use of r50 to one-shot everything since it is the easiest and most efficient way


That explains why we are in favor of a cap. We don't want mindless one-shotting.

[Krausus]

Your point is valid and ill paste what I said earlier in another thread:



but to be fair, it would be lame if they were just another mean to SP... they could just fix the leves, behest and make party grind viable to serve that end and give dungeons a BCNM feel but with a dungeon concept to them.

I honestly think that they will only be good for gear, I doubt their focus will be for SP but of course that's all speculation. But again its a mid rank dungeon. A majority of people will not spend much time there so whats the point of spending all those resources and time to limit its playability? Who cares if a rank 50 blows through there its mid rank gear that will be replaced rather quickly. This dungeon is not going to mean anything its a distraction at best I would rather they add in more dungeons one for every 5 ranks preferably and if they want to add in a cap system but still focus on content then that is fine with me, its not going to effect me anyways.

PS: why would no cap make them shallow, look at all the other MMOs out there that have no cap dungeons, it usually takes them years before they become obsolete, and really who cares by that time they have already added in so much other content it doesn't matter. If SE wants to ensure that the dungeons are always used then they should do something like add in progression quest lines, which they may be doing with the quest that leads up to entering the dungeon, who knows maybe after completing said quest the quest line will continue.

[Rentahamster]

PS: why would no cap make them shallow, look at all the other MMOs out there that have no cap dungeons, it usually takes them years before they become obsolete,

Not sure why so many people are in an uproar concerning this, most games do not level cap dungeons. If people want to have high levels run them through then so be it, it does not effect you in any way whatsoever. People need to get over themselves and stop trying to force their game play style on others.

I covered that point right here:

Yes. Important point to take away here is that in WoW, there is essentially a pseudo-level cap since most of the raid loot is bound to your character, so you have to play as that character to acquire the items anyway.

In FF14, since a single character can be multiple classes, using your high rank class to easily farm items for your lower ranked class would ruin game balance.

This is why the need for level caps in games like FF11 and FF14 is much more necessary than in other MMOs where you can't be every job on one character.

[Krausus]

One more arguement for Pro-cap.

-Level caped items will always have a market even in a legacy server where characters are all higher levels.

God knows that in FFXI it was a pain to sell any lower level equipment on Odin when it got closed off.

what makes you think these items can be sold? they could easily be like all the mid rank NM gear

[Krausus]

I covered that point right here:

how? because you say so? explain how it will ruin game balance? this isn't endgame gear, there is no PvP, the gear very well maybe rare/exclusive like all the mid range NM gear. Your vision of a ruined game balance because of mid level gear is very much extreme and quite hyperbolish.

[Eekiki]

What you didn't have friends as a kid? up, up, down, down, left, right, left, right, B, A, Select, Start

Depends on the game. Some of them used select, some didn't. Contra did not.

SO THERE.

[Rentahamster]

how? because you say so? explain how it will ruin game balance? this isn't endgame gear, there is no PvP, the gear very well maybe rare/exclusive like all the mid range NM gear. Your vision of a ruined game balance because of mid level gear is very much extreme and quite hyperbolish.

It's twinking. Do you think twinking is detrimental to game balance in an MMO? Especially in a game where you can bybass soul-bound restrictions since all your alternate classes are on the same character? Especially in a game that has an economy in which crafting is supposed to have a large role?

If you can plow through a rank 25 dungeon to get the best gear for your rank 25 alt classes, there's no reason to buy any normal gear from crafters, and the economy is damaged.

[Krausus]

It's twinking. Do you think twinking is detrimental to game balance in an MMO? Especially in a game where you can bybass soul-bound restrictions since all your alternate classes are on the same character? Especially in a game that has an economy in which crafting is supposed to have a large role?

No not in an MMO without PvP, who cares if someone spends the time to twink their character in a game that has no PvP therefore no negative effects on game balance

If you can plow through a rank 25 dungeon to get the best gear for your rank 25 alt classes, there's no reason to buy any normal gear from crafters, and the economy is damaged.

to late, for one crafters rarely make rank 25 gear and when they do the price is outrageous because they rarely make it and two there is already mid rank gear better then crafted gear that is much easier to get from NMs. And also people will still buy crafted gear or have somone make the gear for them to use until they get the better gear.

You are making up issues and blowing them out of proportion to try and push your opinions as fact this is hyperbole at its best.