Bard Nerfs Offically Confirmed

[ZaelC]

Melee in coil is not hard. The only boss which may make it sort of tricky is ADS 2, and the rest is smooth sailing. Stop exaggerating.

Please, Im not saying using a melee class in Coil is hard, I am saying that depending on how many melees are in the party the difficulty goes up and with ranged goes down, show me a video where a group beats coil 2 or 4 with 4 melee.

[Nooblet]

Please, Im not saying using a melee class in Coil is hard, I am saying that depending on how many melees are in the party the difficulty goes up and with ranged goes down, show me a video where a group beats coil 2 or 4 with 4 melee.

Don't really see how that relates to nerfing bard... when there's 3 ranged dps and 2 melee. Or is the plan to get blm and smn nerfed next.

The issue should be with content .. though to me it favors having a variety of roles, which I believe is intended. I'm sure most of the issues would settle with 24mans, as having only 4dps doesn't leave a whole lot to play with.

[Crescent_Dusk]

Please, Im not saying using a melee class in Coil is hard, I am saying that depending on how many melees are in the party the difficulty goes up and with ranged goes down, show me a video where a group beats coil 2 or 4 with 4 melee.

Show me a video with 4 black mages. Same crap they're all dead because there's no bard. Tank missed an interrupt? Too bad, your party is 3-4 ranged and the BRD's interrupt is on cooldown and none of the other ranged have a stun/interrupt, eat a Voltage and wipe.

I'm really interested in how you're even going to kill the knights in Turn 4 as well unless you're stacking summoners with bane, because black mages sure as hell won't. Hell, even with bane they can't ruin/pet attack the knights so you might even fail the DPS check on the elevator.

This isn't WoW. Coil is ridiculously easy up to Twintania, and the only reason Twintania isn't down is the cheesy mechanics.

[KogaDrake]

Well didnt real all this, but all I can say is while i dont agree BRD is top dmg, SE is the only one with a true working log of DMG to actually see where each class stands. They will use this when they decide if a nerf is needed or not. Its not going to be based on the players numbers which are all wrong from the available parsers people use.

Further, BRD has more utility than any other DPS (how many people can run coil without one? i know it could be done, but anyone is stupid not to have at least 1 imo) and with songs stacking many people want 2 in an 8man which leaves 2 DPS slots for the other 4 classes. This is the big issues and one way to address this is to lower the dmg to penalize for using multiple. One BRD will always be wanted for their utility unless we see major utility changes to other DPS classes.

Wait to see what they actualy do and how much it actually changes before you QQ so much

[ZaelC]

Don't really see how that relates to nerfing bard... when there's 3 ranged dps and 2 melee. Or is the plan to get blm and smn nerfed next.

The issue should be with content .. though to me it favors having a variety of roles, which I believe is intended. I'm sure most of the issues would settle with 24mans, as having only 4dps doesn't leave a whole lot to play with.

Of course the content is the problem, and BRD is part of that content, Devs made it incredible easy for BRD and what is why they are changing it now. How does it favors a variety of roles when usually in those 4 ranged groups there are at least 2 BRD (I even saw 3 and they beat coil in a breeze), and not because they are better than BLM or SMN in damage, but because the reward in efficiency is higher, big DPS, support buffs, silence, mobility. Its simple and the proofs are in-game, shouts everyday saying "LF Bards for Coil" "LF Bard for AK/WP SR" etc...

Still, I don't really care about what they do or don't do with BRDs, for me its better in that case to buff other DPS classes, but if their choice is to do both nerf and buff its because they actually saw that BRD is superior, and maybe because buffing everyone to the same level where BRD is would make content as easy as it is with a party of 2 - 3 BRDs.

Show me a video with 4 black mages.

Dude, 4 BLM would beat coil easier than any 4 melee group (and I am saying melee group, I'm not even saying "4 DRG group" or "4 MNK group"). Why do you think melees are getting a buff in 2.1?

[Ixsiehn]

Show me a video with 4 black mages. Same crap they're all dead because there's no bard. Tank missed an interrupt? Too bad, your party is 3-4 ranged and the BRD's interrupt is on cooldown and none of the other ranged have a stun/interrupt, eat a Voltage and wipe.

I'm really interested in how you're even going to kill the knights in Turn 4 as well unless you're stacking summoners with bane, because black mages sure as hell won't. Hell, even with bane they can't ruin/pet attack the knights so you might even fail the DPS check on the elevator.

This isn't WoW. Coil is ridiculously easy up to Twintania, and the only reason Twintania isn't down is the cheesy mechanics.

with enough magic damage the knights will get stunned, then they will recieve amplified damage during that time period (same can be said for soldiers + physical damage), turn 4 is still doable with 4 of the same damage type.

[Crescent_Dusk]

with enough magic damage the knights will get stunned, then they will recieve amplified damage during that time period (same can be said for soldiers + physical damage), turn 4 is still doable with 4 of the same damage type.

Damage is not so much a problem as the damage intake you're forcing healers to heal through while a tank is taking a dreadnaught or two. And it's still a delay and hit to optimal situations.

The fact is most raid groups see a lot of variety. 2 melee DPS groups are not rare at all, and I don't know why a split is so bad. Stacking Summoners and black mages simply isn't widespread. All classes are fairly viable, and only bards stand above the others due to their sheer utility, not superior damage.

[NeonC]

Right, I agree completely. So really the answer that everyone would be ok with would be to add utility to ALL classes...

[Pellegri]

Dude, 4 BLM would beat coil easier than any 4 melee group (and I am saying melee group, I'm not even saying "4 DRG group" or "4 MNK group"). Why do you think melees are getting a buff in 2.1?

Melee are getting buffed because having to move at all on a fight gimps their dmg(which you do a lot of in coil). Also have you seen turn 4? 4 melee aslong as they can pass the aoe check it's joke when they can nuke the knights and then soldiers take very little to bring into their burn mode when stoneskin doesn't take that many hits to break in the first place. How would you suggest 4 blms kill the knights? run up to them and melee attack? because they cannot even hit them without their dmg getting reflected. I don't care how good you think your healers are, they are not healing 4 mages though 800-2k hits every 2-3secs when they all attempt to bring down a knight.

Also a team of 4 mage dps is not completing turn 2, you are putting far too much stress on the tanks to be ready for each and every interrupt that goes out on all the nodes and ADS. The tanks have to move throughout the fight too, so tell me what happens when a tank that is on their turn for interrupt duty is on the gcd because they can't stop using abilities or they lose threat? what happens when they have to move out of the fire further into the fight and he uses a shock right after the aoe goes off? If a tank isn't there to catch it or if the only one that has their interrupt off cd isn't able to run back fast enough whos going to prevent the wipe that a shock would cause that far into the fight?

[Aricori]

The damage nerf I feel will not be significant and will not affect our demand in groups. Those who are quitting because they feel they won't be number one are being really petty. My expectations when I began this game was that bard would not be top of the damage, but brought along for their utility and that is the main reason they are invited to Coil from my limited understanding of the raid (I have only been to Turn 2). While our mobility is advantageous, our silence and songs are what makes us desirable. I do feel that monks and dragoons do need a boost in their DPS. They lack the utility of ranged classes as a whole really; no back up heals, resurrection or crowd control abilities means they should be topping the DPS charts. While Monk and Dragoon do have some utility, it is not nearly as desirable as the ranged classes, let alone bard.