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  1. #1
    Player
    Takeshi_Eiketsu's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
    Location
    Ul'Dah
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    174
    Character
    Takeshi Eiketsu
    World
    Maduin
    Main Class
    Pugilist Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Kryptic View Post
    People claiming to not have enough time to wait for HNMs
    That's the beauty of HNMs you don't have to wait depending on the window at hand. If it's in your time zone and in your schedule great you are able to go after it and hope you get claim on it. If you don't and if it fits into your schedule when it's getting ready to respawn good luck to you. But to be so selfish as to say every piece of content has to fit around my life and work schedule is ridiculous. There are a ton of people who only go to school or work a few days a week or both whatever it may be. (1.) So people who have the option to play 8-10 hours a day should have the same chance at good gear as someone who plays an hour a day? That's unfair and makes almost every piece of gear less rewarding to get.
    (2.)That's like if we worked the same job but I worked 8 hours a day and you only had to work 2 hours a day but we get the same pay.
    (1.) Yes, those who have to work more hours than you do, should have the same chance and right to get the gear that you do. Just because you don't work as hard or as much as others, does not make you special in games.

    (2.) That is a horrible analogy. So a 2 hour a day person gets 40$ an hour (hypothetically to match your analogy), and the 8 hour a day person makes 10$...then they both make 80$ a day...that is your analogy to making HNMs fair so that anyone on any schedule can have a chance at (A REALISTIC CHANCE, not your "If you're in the right window, then good for you, if not then your screwed" chance.)

    A BETTER analogy would be: There is a contest that gives away a computer if you can complete an obstacle course, and this course is open 24 hours, now the person who lives in mommy's basement and the 9a-5p worker has a chance at it.

    What you want is: Contest is the same, but only runs from 3p-5p every day or two days. NO PROBLEM FOR BASEMENT BOY! But unfortunately for the worker, he has to hope that it matches his days off.


    PS. I don't work, I go to school for only 4-5 hours a day. Monday-Friday, and I live with my wife's parents. So I am one of the "LOT OF FREE TIME" people, and I don't agree with your statement.

  2. #2
    Player
    Kryptic's Avatar
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    Jul 2011
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    36
    Character
    Vanquish Rainemard
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Takeshi_Eiketsu View Post
    (1.) Yes, those who have to work more hours than you do, should have the same chance and right to get the gear that you do. Just because you don't work as hard or as much as others, does not make you special in games.

    (2.) That is a horrible analogy. So a 2 hour a day person gets 40$ an hour (hypothetically to match your analogy), and the 8 hour a day person makes 10$...then they both make 80$ a day...that is your analogy to making HNMs fair so that anyone on any schedule can have a chance at (A REALISTIC CHANCE, not your "If you're in the right window, then good for you, if not then your screwed" chance.)

    A BETTER analogy would be: There is a contest that gives away a computer if you can complete an obstacle course, and this course is open 24 hours, now the person who lives in mommy's basement and the 9a-5p worker has a chance at it.

    What you want is: Contest is the same, but only runs from 3p-5p every day or two days. NO PROBLEM FOR BASEMENT BOY! But unfortunately for the worker, he has to hope that it matches his days off.


    PS. I don't work, I go to school for only 4-5 hours a day. Monday-Friday, and I live with my wife's parents. So I am one of the "LOT OF FREE TIME" people, and I don't agree with your statement.

    Exactly the respawn is set 21-24 hours so that constantly changes and eventually it'll be in your time zone. If it keeps respawning at 21 hours which it'll do sometimes it'll still get to your time period. Not everything can be super convenient takes the enjoyment away from actually getting something. And you are still acting like this will be the ONLY form of content and it wont be their will be plenty of things to do, other monsters, dungeons, force pop, whatever it may be. It doesn't make you any less special just some people have more hours to dedicate so why should they not be rewarded? They are playing a game more and they deserve more for putting in more hours..
    (0)

  3. #3
    Player
    Xatsh's Avatar
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    Mar 2011
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    Uldah
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    2,011
    Character
    Xatsh Vei
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    White Mage Lv 90
    Quote Originally Posted by Takeshi_Eiketsu View Post
    (1.) Yes, those who have to work more hours than you do, should have the same chance and right to get the gear that you do. Just because you don't work as hard or as much as others, does not make you special in games.

    (2.) That is a horrible analogy. So a 2 hour a day person gets 40$ an hour (hypothetically to match your analogy), and the 8 hour a day person makes 10$...then they both make 80$ a day...that is your analogy to making HNMs fair so that anyone on any schedule can have a chance at (A REALISTIC CHANCE, not your "If you're in the right window, then good for you, if not then your screwed" chance.)

    A BETTER analogy would be: There is a contest that gives away a computer if you can complete an obstacle course, and this course is open 24 hours, now the person who lives in mommy's basement and the 9a-5p worker has a chance at it.

    What you want is: Contest is the same, but only runs from 3p-5p every day or two days. NO PROBLEM FOR BASEMENT BOY! But unfortunately for the worker, he has to hope that it matches his days off.


    PS. I don't work, I go to school for only 4-5 hours a day. Monday-Friday, and I live with my wife's parents. So I am one of the "LOT OF FREE TIME" people, and I don't agree with your statement.
    This is a game, some countries outside the US consider gaming a sport. But like anything in RL you get what you put into it.

    Current gen mmos are the only activity in the WORLD where the mentality is little time has to = alot of time in terms of progress or chance. If someone puts in 8-12 hrs a day more then someone else they should get better things, if not there is something wrong. It goes the same way with literally everything else in life. The more you put into it the more you get.

    If you want to have the same chance it is easy. Get a job that works around the game, schedule your classes around your raid schedule, tell your friends NO when they ask you to go out. That will sound crazy to many, but those that do this should end up better then the play when they have free time only person. This is what defines you as hardcore. The mentality hardcore = hard content is really wrong. For many this is impossible, but it is a life style choice. The difference between a hardcore mmo gamer and a casual mmo gamer.

    I went to class full time in college and worked a part time job and still made hnm camps 50% of the time in XI. Thing is I went when they were up, I didn't wait until it was my Prime time. It all depends on how serious you are I would wake up a 3am est to kill fafnir. In my eyes I deserve to get a drop before the people who only choose to camp it between the hours of 7pm est and 11 pm est. I see nothing unfair about it, I see the counter argument extremely unfair though. Why should say me who can play 16hrs a day if needed have equal chance at getting gear as someone who plays 1hr 30mins a day.
    (2)

  4. #4
    Player
    Kryptic's Avatar
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    Jul 2011
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    36
    Character
    Vanquish Rainemard
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Xatsh View Post
    This is a game, some countries outside the US consider gaming a sport. But like anything in RL you get what you put into it.

    Current gen mmos are the only activity in the WORLD where the mentality is little time has to = alot of time in terms of progress or chance. If someone puts in 8-12 hrs a day more then someone else they should get better things, if not there is something wrong. It goes the same way with literally everything else in life. The more you put into it the more you get.

    If you want to have the same chance it is easy. Get a job that works around the game, schedule your classes around your raid schedule, tell your friends NO when they ask you to go out. That will sound crazy to many, but those that do this should end up better then the play when they have free time only person. This is what defines you as hardcore. The mentality hardcore = hard content is really wrong. For many this is impossible, but it is a life style choice. The difference between a hardcore mmo gamer and a casual mmo gamer.

    I went to class full time in college and worked a part time job and still made hnm camps 50% of the time in XI. Thing is I went when they were up, I didn't wait until it was my Prime time. It all depends on how serious you are I would wake up a 3am est to kill fafnir. In my eyes I deserve to get a drop before the people who only choose to camp it between the hours of 7pm est and 11 pm est. I see nothing unfair about it, I see the counter argument extremely unfair though. Why should say me who can play 16hrs a day if needed have equal chance at getting gear as someone who plays 1hr 30mins a day.
    I was the same way back a few years ago when I was still playing FFXI on the fenrir server I would go out a lot.. and still make it to HNM spawns I would do my best to. Obviously RL first then the game and I still managed to have an 85% attendance for the DKP system. If you really wanna be there for an HNM you will be. I use to wake up at 4 am and sleep in between windows before school because I wanted gear lol
    (0)

  5. #5
    Player
    AttacKat's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    500
    Character
    Attackat Muaddib
    World
    Leviathan
    Main Class
    Marauder Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Xatsh View Post
    But like anything in RL you get what you put into it. ...

    If someone puts in 8-12 hrs a day more then someone else they should get better things, if not there is something wrong. It goes the same way with literally everything else in life. The more you put into it the more you get.
    To borrow your quote and to mention an important point where this thinking is a myth so far for FF14 ...

    How many of you have gotten tens, maybe even hundreds, the steel key from Nathalan's wolf camp, and still never got the mask? I have one of those mask, on my 2nd try.

    One major factor you guys are forgetting, is the RNG SE had in place for 1.0, and that totally nullifies the "play time" factor you guys are claiming to be so important. Ever tried to get an Iffy weapon, and after 10+ tries, a noob comes into your party and gets one on their first win? Again, the RNG totally nullifies how much time you have put into this.

    Pop window, combined with the RNG that existed in 1.0, really doesn't equate to more time = better equipment.

    As is, the loot system is unfair, and hopefully with the changes coming, we will see a more well balanced loot system in term of giving out the rewards.

    jc
    (2)

  6. #6
    Player
    Kryptic's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2011
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    36
    Character
    Vanquish Rainemard
    World
    Balmung
    Main Class
    Thaumaturge Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by AttacKat View Post
    To borrow your quote and to mention an important point where this thinking is a myth so far for FF14 ...

    How many of you have gotten tens, maybe even hundreds, the steel key from Nathalan's wolf camp, and still never got the mask? I have one of those mask, on my 2nd try.

    One major factor you guys are forgetting, is the RNG SE had in place for 1.0, and that totally nullifies the "play time" factor you guys are claiming to be so important. Ever tried to get an Iffy weapon, and after 10+ tries, a noob comes into your party and gets one on their first win? Again, the RNG totally nullifies how much time you have put into this.

    Pop window, combined with the RNG that existed in 1.0, really doesn't equate to more time = better equipment.

    As is, the loot system is unfair, and hopefully with the changes coming, we will see a more well balanced loot system in term of giving out the rewards.

    jc
    You aren't getting it, I understand the range there is and the chances of getting equipment in 14. I'm not suggesting to make HNMs a priority that everyone needs to do, the chances in FFXI were probably 10x worse than FFXI when it came to the super rare items like the defending ring, ridill etc. But when you finally got one of those it was the best feeling in the entire world. It took me over a year to get a dalmatica but when I finally got it, it was the best feeling ever, even though it was only a refresh piece. You can still edit the %s for drops on the HNMs but I don't want the best drop off of every kill, nor do I want to see one every other day. That's what doesn't make getting epic equipment fun. When you see some badass walking around in town in FFXI with some serious equipment you know he busted his ass and didn't have anything handed to him. That's all I am asking, I don't care if it takes 10 tries to see a great piece of equipment. Hell I remember going months without seeing a Ridill, but that's what made it a great piece of gear (obviously including the stats).
    (3)

  7. #7
    Player
    Jeronlmo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    384
    Character
    Jeronlmo Sai
    World
    Hyperion
    Main Class
    Conjurer Lv 50
    Quote Originally Posted by Takeshi_Eiketsu View Post
    (1.) Yes, those who have to work more hours than you do, should have the same chance and right to get the gear that you do. Just because you don't work as hard or as much as others, does not make you special in games.

    (2.) That is a horrible analogy. So a 2 hour a day person gets 40$ an hour (hypothetically to match your analogy), and the 8 hour a day person makes 10$...then they both make 80$ a day...that is your analogy to making HNMs fair so that anyone on any schedule can have a chance at (A REALISTIC CHANCE, not your "If you're in the right window, then good for you, if not then your screwed" chance.)

    3.)A BETTER analogy would be: There is a contest that gives away a computer if you can complete an obstacle course, and this course is open 24 hours, now the person who lives in mommy's basement and the 9a-5p worker has a chance at it.

    4.)What you want is: Contest is the same, but only runs from 3p-5p every day or two days. NO PROBLEM FOR BASEMENT BOY! But unfortunately for the worker, he has to hope that it matches his days off.


    5.)PS. I don't work, I go to school for only 4-5 hours a day. Monday-Friday, and I live with my wife's parents. So I am one of the "LOT OF FREE TIME" people, and I don't agree with your statement.
    Work smart, not hard, you working 12hrs a day is not my problem, I own my own business and do alot of the work I do from home. This argument is sad and you should stop trying to use it, anything at all involving your real life, I do not want to hear it.

    1) The word Chance plays a big role here. The fact that you work more than others, does not mean that in this game you should have equal chances by default, the fact that you have a chance though, should always hold true.

    Lets say you play WoW, you play once a month and considering raids have week-long lockouts your only going to do said raid once a month, you had 1 chance.

    Now lets say someone else in the world plays WoW, they play every day because they actually enjoy gaming and that pos game, they have 3 chance at that same raid.

    I understand this math is almost impossible to understand but if you play more, you get more, your chances go up.

    2) The analogy works fine.

    Quote Originally Posted by Kryptic View Post
    People claiming to not have enough time to wait for HNMs
    That's the beauty of HNMs you don't have to wait depending on the window at hand. If it's in your time zone and in your schedule great you are able to go after it and hope you get claim on it. If you don't and if it fits into your schedule when it's getting ready to respawn good luck to you. But to be so selfish as to say every piece of content has to fit around my life and work schedule is ridiculous. There are a ton of people who only go to school or work a few days a week or both whatever it may be. So people who have the option to play 8-10 hours a day should have the same chance at good gear as someone who plays an hour a day? That's unfair and makes almost every piece of gear less rewarding to get.
    That's like if we worked the same job but I worked 8 hours a day and you only had to work 2 hours a day but we get the same pay.
    I am not responding to this quote above, this is me still responding to Takeshi_Eiketsu (just to avoid confusion..)

    You seem to think that no matter the time played, all people that ever log on should have the exact same chance at anything at any given time (aka you) so lets test this analogy under what you seem to think.
    Person A) working 8hrs, lets say he makes $80.
    Person B) working 2hrs, Under your theory would have to also make $80.
    To us, this is what you are trying to sell us, its insane, if I play more than you, I get more. The fact that you have poor time management should not/is not my problem, maby a RPG would more readily fit your lifestyle.

    3) Your analogy would imply that you believe a 24hrs respawn literally means a 24hr window... herp derp I believe is the correct responce to this.

    The actual fact is if windows were 21-24hrs (3hr in total). Everybody has equal chances to claim HNM's, the difference if you play more is that you get those same chances more often by means of time zones. The chances are always there for you if you log on more, you just refuse to.

    4) This if anything speaks against what Alhanelem wants, the only time this would ever happen is if there are no windows, the fact that windows existed in FF11 kept the time when the HNM spawned, moving. Every few days the window would have moved 2-6hrs.

    5) Dont care.
    (2)
    Last edited by Jeronlmo; 02-03-2013 at 10:47 PM.