Fresh Start will ruin 2.0

[Azurymber]

Ok.

Lets use FFXI as an example.
Back in the day, ffxi had this thing called rusty cap fishing. 400+ ppl would sit around rabao fishbotting rusty caps and npc;ing them
Many of those were RMTs

As a result RMTs accumulated millions of gil
One christmas RMTs unloaded all that gil at incredibly low prices, and lots of people bought it up

Hyperinflation occurred. Prices went up to 10 times their value or more overnight (woodsville on my server went from 200k to well over 50mil in under 24 hours, and ppl were buying them)
After this, the economy was a mess for years
SE's solution was to move away from AH items like P-charm, Scorp harness, Hauberk+1, etc, and move towards rare/ex gear

It also took them years to get a lot of that gil out of the economy through things like mass bans or material sales (like the thing for the bard armor that was 1milish)

Now since all FFXI servers were essentially the same, it was viable to "fix" the economy.

But what about FFXIV? RMTs and lots of normal players on OLD servers have hoarded 100mil + gil
Now lets say SE releases something like dynamis-relic-weapons where you can buy the 1000s of items needed to make them.
People will start spending all those 100mil+ in the economy creating inflation. RMT will pump in millions of gil, leading to hyperinflation. Item prices will skyrocket and stay high because there is -so- much gil circulating in the economy.

Now with the new system, new players will find it very difficult to be able to make the gil needed to buy good end-game gear.

So people will complain and cry that they can't get anything cuz the economy sucks (much like they did in ffxi)

But, can SE fix it? no.
Why? because any gil-sink they implemented to fix it would not work on new servers who do not have hyper inflation as there were never billions of gil being stored up by individuals and RMT.

So lets say they create a crafting item for a new weapon or "epic" armor that you have to purchase from an npc (i believe there already are some at the hamlets). The people on the hyperinflated server could easily attain them, but people on other server's couldn't.
So on an old server you might have 1000 ppl with the gil-sink armor
but on a new sever you might have 40.

And what will obviously happen? the new server's population will rage about how they aren't treated fairly, etc etc.

That is the point im getting at.....

New servers will seriously limit anything that SE can do that is gil-related

So what you will end up with is a game where everything is rare-ex. And the economy will end up like it was a year ago prior to darkhold (dead).

[Zenaku]

Ok.

Lets use FFXI as an example.
Back in the day, ffxi had this thing called rusty cap fishing. 400+ ppl would sit around rabao fishbotting rusty caps and npc;ing them
Many of those were RMTs

As a result RMTs accumulated millions of gil
One christmas RMTs unloaded all that gil at incredibly low prices, and lots of people bought it up

Hyperinflation occurred. Prices went up to 10 times their value or more overnight (woodsville on my server went from 200k to well over 50mil in under 24 hours, and ppl were buying them)
After this, the economy was a mess for years
SE's solution was to move away from AH items like P-charm, Scorp harness, Hauberk+1, etc, and move towards rare/ex gear

It also took them years to get a lot of that gil out of the economy through things like mass bans or material sales (like the thing for the bard armor that was 1milish)

Now since all FFXI servers were essentially the same, it was viable to "fix" the economy.

But what about FFXIV? RMTs and lots of normal players on OLD servers have hoarded 100mil + gil
Now lets say SE releases something like dynamis-relic-weapons where you can buy the 1000s of items needed to make them.
People will start spending all those 100mil+ in the economy creating inflation. RMT will pump in millions of gil, leading to hyperinflation. Item prices will skyrocket and stay high because there is -so- much gil circulating in the economy.

Now with the new system, new players will find it very difficult to be able to make the gil needed to buy good end-game gear.

So people will complain and cry that they can't get anything cuz the economy sucks (much like they did in ffxi)

But, can SE fix it? no.
Why? because any gil-sink they implemented to fix it would not work on new servers who do not have hyper inflation as there were never billions of gil being stored up by individuals and RMT.

So lets say they create a crafting item for a new weapon or "epic" armor that you have to purchase from an npc (i believe there already are some at the hamlets). The people on the hyperinflated server could easily attain them, but people on other server's couldn't.
So on an old server you might have 1000 ppl with the gil-sink armor
but on a new sever you might have 40.

And what will obviously happen? the new server's population will rage about how they aren't treated fairly, etc etc.

That is the point im getting at.....

New servers will seriously limit anything that SE can do that is gil-related

So what you will end up with is a game where everything is rare-ex. And the economy will end up like it was a year ago prior to darkhold (dead).

Once again "If people want to play on a world that everyone is level 1 and build there own economy /community why should you care? would it affect you in any way?"

They trying to resell this game to new players and seeing how so far this been a beta and they not going to delete our char making servers that only new level 1 can join would make new players who don't have friend want to play. Also how in the hell adding new servers that only level 1 can join mess with the servers that have high level players in any way? Yoshi-p said he going to add new servers so it going to happen and noting you say would change that and if he does change his mind then he not as smart as everyone think he is.

End of story

[Alerith]

-snip-

How?

If one of those items costs, for example, 500,000 gil.

The original server with everyone who has level 50, gear, blah blah blah, still have to make 500,000 gil to buy the item. Whether or not they already have the gil is irrelevant. It still had to be obtained somehow.

Cut to the new server with fresh start players.

They still have to make that same 500,000 gil to buy the same item. And the exact same means of obtaining the gil are in the game. Selling your wares, levequests, NPC'ing garbage loot, etc.

[Lamentor]

When referring to new servers, if all current players are more or less evenly distributed between servers at 2.0 launch, then most servers and their economy will look the same generally. Actually, I was going to say more, but since I know this will be the case, this whole argument is void.

At worst, you'll have 1.0 players (rightfully) that have a major advantage in the economy for the first few months of the release of 2.0. After about 4-5 months, even new players will be caught up to veteran players. It isn't anything too serious.

Edit: I know this isn't going to happen, but this would ONLY be a problem if new players were separated from 1.0 players, then later SE allowed server transfers, which would cause massive problems. BUT! I know this will not happen, because as much as SE has messed things up in the past, they're not dumb enough to do something like that.

[Chardrizard]

That is all nice and dandy theory except our economy is highly active while having most of the best slots being U/U. You should post this in FFXI forum because this isn't happening in FFXIV.

[Disc]

Think of it more on the level of FFXI JP vs NA release. The JP players originally had a monopoly over the AH because they had more gil & higher combat/craft levels. Within about 1 year NA players caught up & started competing by farming/crafting the same items & hunting the same HNM's.

The 2005 RMT christmas was a different type of story all together. Instead of just introducing new players to a live economy with set prices there was a mass influx of gil from the Tavnazia glitch making people of all levels poor.

[Alhanelem]

If they actually have "fresh start" servers it will ruin 2.0 for a very simple reason.

Um, why would it ruin the game? Every game makes new servers when the population increases. Nobody's forced to move to those servers nor is anyone forced to have a "fresh start." They are not resetting our characters or deleting anything when 2.0 comes out. Though usually, when a new server is added, existing players are invited to transfer over to it to help establish its economy. Nobody's forced to do that, either.


Every new server in any MMO is a "fresh start" server. What is anybody worried about? Why does this thread exist?

[Galliano]

What the hell? Name 1 item that is purchasable and I will tell you how a fresh starting player can obtain it in under 48 hours playtime.

Aside from Vanya/Gryphonskin/lulclass weapons.

Sent body ^^

[Azurymber]

What most of you are saying is that a new server's economy will essentially end up the same as the old server's economy.

So lets use a real world analogy

Current servers are germany post ww1. Excess amounts of money are printed, there is hyper inflation, bread goes from 1 mark to 1 million marks in a week.

New servers are any other country not experiencing hyperinflation.

Now lets say germany didn't introduce the Rentenmark indexed to gold bonds. Would you seriously argue that Germany's Reichsbank mark would rebound and balance out?

Would you argue germany's hyperinflated economy was the same as the US economy (experiencing deflation in the great depression), and that it would be wise to apply the same economic decisions to both economies?

MMOs have an economy, and whether you like it or not, they need to be regulated to a degree. That means there -has- to be a balance between gil sinks and gil sources in ffxiv. However, you need to regulate things differently in different situations. If an economy is experiencing deflation, it is very different from inflation.

With old and new servers, it is very easy for a policy that reduces inflation on old servers to create deflation on new servers, and vice versa. It will be nearly impossible to create balanced functioning economies.

Economies do not balance out on their own. They -should- but they don't. And the reason is because humans are irrational. This game is no different than the real world. Economies will -never- balance on their own. And if you think they will, you are dreaming. Because if economics were that simple, depressions and over-expansions would not occur.

[Zenaku]

What most of you are saying is that a new server's economy will essentially end up the same as the old server's economy.

So lets use a real world analogy

Current servers are germany post ww1. Excess amounts of money are printed, there is hyper inflation, bread goes from 1 mark to 1 million marks in a week.

New servers are any other country not experiencing hyperinflation.

Now lets say germany didn't introduce the Rentenmark indexed to gold bonds. Would you seriously argue that Germany's Reichsbank mark would rebound and balance out?

Would you argue germany's hyperinflated economy was the same as the US economy (experiencing deflation in the great depression), and that it would be wise to apply the same economic decisions to both economies?

MMOs have an economy, and whether you like it or not, they need to be regulated to a degree. That means there -has- to be a balance between gil sinks and gil sources in ffxiv. However, you need to regulate things differently in different situations. If an economy is experiencing deflation, it is very different from inflation.

With old and new servers, it is very easy for a policy that reduces inflation on old servers to create deflation on new servers, and vice versa. It will be nearly impossible to create balanced functioning economies.

Economies do not balance out on their own. They -should- but they don't. And the reason is because humans are irrational. This game is no different than the real world. Economies will -never- balance on their own. And if you think they will, you are dreaming. Because if economics were that simple, depressions and over-expansions would not occur.

omg who cares how would other server economies best with your gameplay? you keep talking but your not answering that simple question why the hell do you care so much about other severs you not going to play on?

Some people want to play on servers that is fresh seeing how 2.0 is a fresh start.

This is a game not Real life if Ash tuna cost 5k in server A and in world B it cost 100gil it wont matter noting going to happen so you keep doing your wall of text all you want you still not proving your point in any way.