fflogs and privacy

[Tulvi]

this is the most unhinged reply in the entire thread lmao

A bit extreme opinion, for sure (the one you’re replying to), but what is the real added value of FF logs anyway, if all harder content in this game follows the same formula? Every piece of hard content progression I’ve seen or experienced first hand went like this:

1. Learn the mechanics
2. Try to die as little as possible
3. As long as you know your class and there aren’t too many deaths, the party will eventually clear

PF usually does a good job at filtering out players who are obviously unaware of how their job is played. No need to see logs for that (unless you are forming a static and want to play with the best of the best).

Usually, people do know their jobs and gear / correct DPS rotations aren’t the problem - mechanics are usually the problem and staying alive enough to meet the DPS check at enrage. Therefore raiding in this game isn’t that much skill-bound, rather than awareness and memory-bound.
I’ve honestly never seen a party in which no more than 2-3 players died during a duty to be unable to clear. Ultimates might be an exception, I’ve never tried those, but the standard harder content (Savage and Extremes) do not seem to be DPS-checks oriented, but they are rather a “dance” of which when you learn the moves, you’ll be safe and clear eventually.

So why is there even a need for something like FF logs in the case of FF XIV? I know it can analyse a player’s performance during a fight and offer recommendations, but that only makes it a good education tool.

I just really don’t see the need to min-max and optimise the **** out of one’s DPS if the game is more focused on understanding the fight, rather than chasing DPS checks.

Again, this might not apply to statics, where I do understand why people are looking to play with consistent enough players with a track record.

[Lilapop]

A bit extreme opinion, for sure (the one you’re replying to), but what is the real added value of FF logs anyway, if all harder content in this game follows the same formula? Every piece of hard content progression I’ve seen or experienced first hand went like this:

1. Learn the mechanics
2. Try to die as little as possible
3. As long as you know your class and there aren’t too many deaths, the party will eventually clear

PF usually does a good job at filtering out players who are obviously unaware of how their job is played. No need to see logs for that (unless you are forming a static and want to play with the best of the best).

Usually, people do know their jobs and gear / correct DPS rotations aren’t the problem - mechanics are usually the problem and staying alive enough to meet the DPS check at enrage. Therefore raiding in this game isn’t that much skill-bound, rather than awareness and memory-bound.
I’ve honestly never seen a party in which no more than 2-3 players died during a duty to be unable to clear. Ultimates might be an exception, I’ve never tried those, but the standard harder content (Savage and Extremes) do not seem to be DPS-checks oriented, but they are rather a “dance” of which when you learn the moves, you’ll be safe and clear eventually.

So why is there even a need for something like FF logs in the case of FF XIV? I know it can analyse a player’s performance during a fight and offer recommendations, but that only makes it a good education tool.

I just really don’t see the need to min-max and optimise the **** out of one’s DPS if the game is more focused on understanding the fight, rather than chasing DPS checks.

Again, this might not apply to statics, where I do understand why people are looking to play with consistent enough players with a track record.

You forget one thing... "but muh beeg numbers for all 2 see!"

[Collin_Sky]

A bit extreme opinion, for sure (the one you’re replying to), but what is the real added value of FF logs anyway, if all harder content in this game follows the same formula? Every piece of hard content progression I’ve seen or experienced first hand went like this:

1. Learn the mechanics
2. Try to die as little as possible
3. As long as you know your class and there aren’t too many deaths, the party will eventually clear

PF usually does a good job at filtering out players who are obviously unaware of how their job is played. No need to see logs for that (unless you are forming a static and want to play with the best of the best).

Usually, people do know their jobs and gear / correct DPS rotations aren’t the problem - mechanics are usually the problem and staying alive enough to meet the DPS check at enrage. Therefore raiding in this game isn’t that much skill-bound, rather than awareness and memory-bound.
I’ve honestly never seen a party in which no more than 2-3 players died during a duty to be unable to clear. Ultimates might be an exception, I’ve never tried those, but the standard harder content (Savage and Extremes) do not seem to be DPS-checks oriented, but they are rather a “dance” of which when you learn the moves, you’ll be safe and clear eventually.

So why is there even a need for something like FF logs in the case of FF XIV? I know it can analyse a player’s performance during a fight and offer recommendations, but that only makes it a good education tool.

I just really don’t see the need to min-max and optimise the **** out of one’s DPS if the game is more focused on understanding the fight, rather than chasing DPS checks.

Again, this might not apply to statics, where I do understand why people are looking to play with consistent enough players with a track record.

This reply kinda proves you have no idea what features fflogs actually has, and also don't take prog very seriously.

It is immensely valuable for diagnosing wipes. Being able to see what mitigation people had, being able to check how much they were overkilled by, how many heals they received leading up to wipes. This is invaluable for progression.
Here's an image that demonstrates this:


Additionally, as I have said earlier in the thread, it's useful as a tool for double checking what abilities people are using at what times, and ensuring they're being used to maximum value.
It's also valuable as a comparison tool. If I'm playing a healer and I'm unsure about what mit to use, I can literally check a bunch of logs from high ranking healers and compare what they're using, and when. Similarly as a DPS, I can check what fight specific optimisations people are using, and apply that myself. FRU had a LOT of this, so it was very useful to be able to check what the best players are doing.
If you think fflogs isn't useful for prog, you're not serious about prog.

Usually, people do know their jobs and gear / correct DPS rotations aren’t the problem

also lol, the average PF player is terrible at their job

[Exmo]

It is immensely valuable for diagnosing wipes. Being able to see what mitigation people had, being able to check how much they were overkilled by, how many heals they received leading up to wipes. This is invaluable for progression.

You can get all this information in the in-game battle log or by talking to your party members. You should be able to prog a fight without looking up other people's logs and using them as a guide. Sounds like you're using FFLogs as a crutch.

[Collin_Sky]

You can get all this information in the in-game battle log or by talking to your party members. You should be able to prog a fight without looking up other people's logs and using them as a guide. Sounds like you're using FFLogs as a crutch.

[Lilapop]

Ah yes, the classic "we disagree so ur trolling/uneducated" or "ur baiting the forums lol get good skrub!"

[Aco505]

Ah yes, the classic "we disagree so ur trolling/uneducated" or "ur baiting the forums lol get good skrub!"

The battle log is impossible to read. It's a huge mess and you cannot even filter what to see or not see. SE should improve it drastically and add DoT/HoT values in there, as well.

So the reply to that sentence is correct: the battle log cannot be used for this purpose, as anyone that had spent a modicum of time trying would very quickly know.

[Lilapop]

The battle log is impossible to read. It's a huge mess and you cannot even filter what to see or not see. SE should improve it drastically and add DoT/HoT values in there, as well.

So the reply to that sentence is correct: the battle log cannot be used for this purpose, as anyone that had spent a modicum of time trying would very quickly know.

I think that you thought I was trying to say something entirely different, but I don't know what it could be.

[Exmo]

The battle log is impossible to read. It's a huge mess and you cannot even filter what to see or not see. SE should improve it drastically and add DoT/HoT values in there, as well.

So the reply to that sentence is correct: the battle log cannot be used for this purpose, as anyone that had spent a modicum of time trying would very quickly know.

I've used it for this purpose plenty of times, so skill issue.

[SongOfTheWind]

The battle log is impossible to read. It's a huge mess and you cannot even filter what to see or not see. SE should improve it drastically and add DoT/HoT values in there, as well.

So the reply to that sentence is correct: the battle log cannot be used for this purpose, as anyone that had spent a modicum of time trying would very quickly know.

What do you mean “impossible to read”? I have been in multiple blind progs using solely battle log to realise what is going on at any point we struggle with/not sure what is happening. The situation in the example with what protection/healing used, what damage was applied to you and what killed you - is all there.