Please let us keep our abilities on sync down

[AvoSturmfaust]

I can understand why you desire that but you aren't seeing it as a new player who will never do as much as you will and to do it even if they succeed there is one other problem.


No fight will be balanced allowing a lv100 to sync to exemple ifrit ex first the boss will die way faster then people who will want to live the fight as it was intended.


I am sorry but what you are asking will break all balance of the game at lower lv and will kill pf even more.

Like if you choose to do a sync run Alexander savage why would you welcome someone that is LV 60 with cap gear with a half rotation when you can have a lv100 sync to 60 with a full 100 rotation?


Do you see the bigger picture?


.




WE ALL PAY A SUB

Sorry i dont wanna be rude but whats that for a dumb example? Even synced down in the current state people will take a lvl 100 char instead of a lvl 60 char, doesnt matter the content, take example ShB or EW Ex Trials both are Level 80 or 90 and People still expect people to be lvl 100, so your example is not good at all

[Jeeqbit]

Sorry i dont wanna be rude but whats that for a dumb example? Even synced down in the current state people will take a lvl 100 char instead of a lvl 60 char, doesnt matter the content, take example ShB or EW Ex Trials both are Level 80 or 90 and People still expect people to be lvl 100, so your example is not good at all

Well it is good but both their and your assessment of it isn't right.

When people do MINE and synced content, they are often sprouts or very welcoming of sprouts - I mean literally, they are often free trial players or people that will not progress to the next expansion until they have cleared all the Extreme and Savage synced/MINE (depending on their preference). They often become really good at raiding before they even get to the current expansion given their intense focus on it.

The synced/MINE community wouldn't expect or require that sprout to be max level particularly. However, it could mess everything up if the veteran players just "helping out" had overpowered rotations compared to the sprout, while also unbalancing the content from how it is now, where it can still be enjoyed with a fulfilling difficulty level.

ARR and Heavensward raids and extremes, especially, are trivialized by Bloodwhetting and Shake It Off. The Ultima, Shiva and Sophia we got in Unreal were a joke compared to doing them MINE due to abilities like this by reducing the reliance on the healer, and making the tanking a breeze - so there is little thought into saving cooldowns or cooldown management.

So it would be unfortunate if all the old content was also ruined in this way since they are enjoyed by a lot of sprouts now with how the synced and MINE community has grown since Shadowbringers' launch. That's why there should at least be a Duty Finder setting to sync abilities the way they are currently.

[Nero-Voidstails]

Sorry i dont wanna be rude but whats that for a dumb example? Even synced down in the current state people will take a lvl 100 char instead of a lvl 60 char, doesnt matter the content, take example ShB or EW Ex Trials both are Level 80 or 90 and People still expect people to be lvl 100, so your example is not good at all

ok I will exemple with more dept I was at work timed so forgive me for that haha but we will take Ifrit ex on that who will you pick between a LV 50 from the expension or someone that will be sync down to 50 but with the rotation of a LV 100?


the answer will be the LV 100 because they do way more damage no matter what and it will also kill the boss way faster sadly killing both the experience of new player like imagine a viper sync with LV 50 skill and then see it in the same fight but with the LV 100 rotation who will be better? Even destroy the boss. asking to be able to use all skill at all LV. All dungeon become a joke destroying all balance in the game and even more with new player you could probably see it more into ultimate even more and they are made to challenge you

[Daralii]

ok I will exemple with more dept I was at work timed so forgive me for that haha but we will take Ifrit ex on that who will you pick between a LV 50 from the expension or someone that will be sync down to 50 but with the rotation of a LV 100?


the answer will be the LV 100 because they do way more damage no matter what and it will also kill the boss way faster sadly killing both the experience of new player like imagine a viper sync with LV 50 skill and then see it in the same fight but with the LV 100 rotation who will be better? Even destroy the boss. asking to be able to use all skill at all LV. All dungeon become a joke destroying all balance in the game and even more with new player you could probably see it more into ultimate even more and they are made to challenge you

Except other games that have level sync and let you keep your full kit have damage scalars that make sure someone at the lowest level possible for the dungeon does the same or more damage by spamming 1 ability. As has been said before, the bigger problem with it in XIV would be how dramatically utility, mitigation, and survivability tools improve at certain thresholds.

[AvoSturmfaust]

ok I will exemple with more dept I was at work timed so forgive me for that haha but we will take Ifrit ex on that who will you pick between a LV 50 from the expension or someone that will be sync down to 50 but with the rotation of a LV 100?


the answer will be the LV 100 because they do way more damage no matter what and it will also kill the boss way faster sadly killing both the experience of new player like imagine a viper sync with LV 50 skill and then see it in the same fight but with the LV 100 rotation who will be better? Even destroy the boss. asking to be able to use all skill at all LV. All dungeon become a joke destroying all balance in the game and even more with new player you could probably see it more into ultimate even more and they are made to challenge you

I get your first point, thats why i said i didnt want to sound rude haha, but to your second point the balance is already destroyed thats why i wouldnt balance be a consideration in this case, i mean look at how fast bosses are dying, doesnt matter of alli raid, dungeons etc etc etc if you get in a lower one, we are already at the point where you cant even see 50% of the shit bosses would do because everything is dying way too fast

[AvoSturmfaust]

Btw People forget one important thing, the kit we have now for lv50 as example is not the kit we had in the past, square enix deleted so many skills in the last years, and now we have nothing good and nothing fully suited for the lower content

[ovIm]

Btw People forget one important thing, the kit we have now for lv50 as example is not the kit we had in the past, square enix deleted so many skills in the last years, and now we have nothing good and nothing fully suited for the lower content

Thats another important thing, yeah. We used to have somewhere around 20-30 skills at level 50 in ARR, and ever since then, the amount of buttons have always roughly remained the same even though CS3 added ~5 new skills per class on each expansion, as older abilities were pruned.
Of course that leaves classes in a more and more barebones state on lower levels the more expansions release.

[Shougun]

If you can get extra potency from staggering/breaking, it is the same issue, just laid out differently.

However, adjusting fight mechanics based on how yo interact with the boss is something I have expressed in the past, mainly by stunning/interrupting casts to change their properties, but this could also be extended to changing several moves. But these sorts of mechanics shouldn't just be limited to just when you are synced down.



I don't think finding exact potencies are needed, but a thought on if changes were made, how will it affect things in general shouldn't be too much to ask. In the case of jobs, going from more sustained jobs, where the burst potential is low, compared to level 100 where the burst potential is very high. You have 2 different damage curves and trying to conform one to the other based on content just isn't going to be easy. The only reason I initially pointed out potencies was to highlight the issue that you cannot just take what we have and assume it will be fine.

Eh if they stagger for bonus damage we're assuming we've done what I said and brought runaway scaling down a little, so to be honest no. You definitely don't have that issue. Since you're behind the runaway that we already have (that idea if you read had multiple reasons, one of which was to preserve an interesting content and not turn them into 15 second jokes). So, it's better than before actually.


I think you're just having trouble imagining a job curved down and others are not. I understand you worry that It is not just the same kit with more potency (the kit is 'different' at different levels), but this issue has already been solved by other MMOs, and as I've been saying you will pass over the kit multiple times to clamp it down in different spots so that these are roughly in line. You will have situations where your big burst that was 1k potency is now 350 (where another spell that was normally 400 potency is 325) which might sound funny, but this stuff has been done. A freebie weave skill may be hit even harder (depending on what the low levels expectations are, as you have said some jobs don't have all that at low levels). The only real thing we won't capture for is features, we're going to ignore if scholar can group combat sprint or someone can raise, while their damage is brought down a lot we'll leave the features.


Also I've seen you mention low levels curve a few times and I don't know why because in our situation we are not doing time walking. The low levels are just coming in to do the content as is, unlike time walking we are only poking high levels. We are only dampening.. we don't need to boost.


We especially don't have an issue if we just do the great filter wall (wrapped in stagger/break), because who cares what your kit says at that point. It just reads the incoming amount lol.


Regardless of how hard balancing a curve (not stagger system), I still think that will be much easier and sustainable than hand tweaks to all jobs, but I don't care how they make earlier levels feel better if the end result is it feels better.

[DPZ2]

Assume Square Enix has numbers for maximum damage from each job at each level, as well as numbers for the speed of damage delivery at each instance level, as well as mean-time-to-defeat each mob type at each instance level.

After applying a conversion table, you get your level 100 rotation in Sastasha.

In order to get through Sastasha, your combined DPS with full job bar will be slightly lower than an at-level-with-limited-rotation player.

This is what you will accept?

[Lilapop]

"99% of games did it"

you :

"WELL FFXIV IS THE 1% THATS NORMAL OKAY"

Small indie company strikes again, literally every company can do it, but for FFXIV and SE it's too hard to do.

Keep defending mediocrity.

"we disagree therefore ur defending mediocrity"

No. Learn to read. I am literally stating objective facts. Those games are those games, this game is this game. I know, I know, how dare I speak ill of your beloved FF14.