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Thread: Monk Rant

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  1. #1
    Player
    Tunda's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2024
    Posts
    791
    Character
    Tunda King
    World
    Ragnarok
    Main Class
    Black Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Ramiee View Post
    1. No monster hunter is nothing like FF14, early 2000s games are like XIV though considering it was the MMO boom at that time where everything was trying to be WOW. So yeah you're right about that.
    2. RPGs are subdivided into multiple different subgenres because if everything thats labelled an RPG can be added to FF14 what are we going to add Assassins Creed Vallhalla stuff into XIV? Thats an RPG, what about Diablo thats an RPG. No its a dumb thing to say, take ideas from RPGs in the same subgenre for the PVE of XIV. For side content IDC make a monster hunter inspired gamemode, but its a trinity tab target MMO in its PVE so thats where it should take inspiration from.
    3. ARR, WOW, GW2, Warhammer Online, etc. All tried elemental defenses and unique damage types, none of these games kept them, it doesn't work in an MMO stop trying to make it work.
    4. ShB onwards has had the job design far worse than ARR-SB so yeah they aren't "way better" considering you just have to look at role forums to see everyone complaining about jobs, so no developers from 2013-2019 aren't better than 2019-2024 it seems like people find them to be worse.


    1- it is your opinion and I do not agree with it.
    2- sorry but current FFXIV is barley an RPG with almost no elements that can be interacted during encounters and gear.
    RPG elements are not only(wind,fire,water stone)
    but stats that can lead to different builds and playstyles.
    Monster hunter have gearsets which can change how you play the class.
    Diablo 4/PoE give you different paths so you can build you class using RPG elements with these elements you can shift your playstyle.
    I didn't play AC games before so I can't judge.

    let's take an example in FFXIV : Stats are beyond braindead with nothing that matter other than crit which is bad design.. at least other RPGs can give you the options to take different routs to play the game.. that doesn't exist in FFXIV.. in summary FFXIV is MMORPG which is barely RPG game.

    3- I didn't agree and didn't mention in any post that jobs should have element defensive weakness.. again read my post carefully before you judge.
    4- when you narrow the gameplay of the jobs to the point where 90% of kit are the same for healers and tanks this is bad design.. before ShB FFXIV was trying to shape the game with good ideas but they failed in execution.. I believe developers learned a lot.. 11 years will teach you thing or two.
    again good ideas bad execution we need to improve the execution not the idea.
    not all ideas in ARR HW SB are good but some of them are and can be improved.
    developers lost their vision for developing job design/encounters to just make things easier to balance.. while now we have healers are just a glam change with same kit.
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    Last edited by Tunda; 09-04-2024 at 04:09 AM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Shurrikhan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Posts
    12,870
    Character
    Tani Shirai
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    On RPGs:

    If you are making decisions about where to go, what to specialize towards, etc. in such a way as to feel immersed into that world and into your character, the game can be an role-playing game. Alternatively, even if you feel no personal connection to the character, but the view into the world is altered by their frame of reference as to playing as them rather than merely a them-skinned hand manipulating a gun or them-shaped obfuscation between your camera and whatever you're swinging at, that is a role-playing game. Because role-playing games are about... playing roles that are part and parcel with the world that you view through them and the personal experience of which you can change to some degree by altering or reframing that role.

    There is no particular customization menu size after which a game is an RPG (let alone just an RPG) nor before which it must be sub-divided into something else. There is a degree of role-play (either through a self-made role or that of a significantly affecting perspective) that splits the difference, though.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ramiee View Post
    early 2000s games are like XIV though considering it was the MMO boom at that time where everything was trying to be WOW.
    Nitpick, but WoW itself didn't come out into the end of 2004 and didn't become any huge leader in popularity until 2005-2006, which is in the second half of the 2000s. And at least many of the competing MMOs in the remainder of that decade specifically tried to be distinct from WoW as to copy it.
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    On Elemental/Many-Categoried Outputs:

    Short Version -- They're bloat-enforcing rubbish.

    Long Version -- Virtually all systems of elements or similar analytic damage types have been rubbish that requires more buttons for the same gameplay results as were possible without that bloat, generally ultimately simplifying gameplay while reducing the content one has full access to. That said, there are undermechanics that can comprise such types but are more universally interactable that can be of use to gameplay. I've yet to see a game handle "elements" or the like in that way, however, which leaves such system best suited only for commanding multiple units rather than being just one unit among many similarly singularly-controlled units, especially in games capable of smaller group sizes and random matchmaking.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tunda View Post
    again good ideas bad execution we need to improve the execution not the idea.
    Outside of mechanical error (literally turning slightly faster or hitting harder than intended, etc.), execution ends up as such specifically because of what ideas went into it. Those ideas can be more integral or more overarching, but the only parts worth discussing are ideas. The rest is someone typing in a potency modifier wrong or slipping up somewhere in a coded procedure.

    And, in many, many cases, the ideas were bad virtually all the way up, i.e., from the point they could be called the 'spirit' or even 'intent' of the idea that would trickle down into implementation. What replaced it hasn't always been better, but you'd have to remove every trace of what X system was from XIV to go far enough back to redeem the idea of, say, separating elemental from unaspected magic damage or of Fire/Frost/Lightning/Earth/Wind/Water Resistance.
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    Last edited by Shurrikhan; 09-04-2024 at 08:43 AM.