Yoshi-P: "If you want more engaging content, go play Ultimate"

[All_Nonsense]

I don't really see a point in taking out bloodwhetting when the primary issue with healing is that the tuning for healers and all those abilities seems to be designed for ultimate content, and the healer role lacks any meaningful dps rotation. Nerfing or negating a single tank's ability isn't going to change those things. I think bloodwhetting should be seen as a *good* thing because it means the healers would have less healing to do firstly, and secondly with an actual dps rotation they'd be able to spend more time focusing on that. I get that WAR has a hypertuned self-sustain kit but it does trade in other areas. I think if healers got a real rotation for dps (or even a modest one) then they'd be on the boards asking SE for more self-sustain for other classes so they could focus more on their rotation. I think balancing self-sustain with healing kits to give healers something to do would be the best route.

Not to mention the ilvl scaling causing some tanks to dissolve while others are half invincible. In terms of difficulty, it might be best to have duties hard locked to a certain ilvl only a la "min ilvl only" as opposed to saying "min is 635, sync is 655" because god is that a massive spread. It's complicated

[Supersnow845]

I don't really see a point in taking out bloodwhetting when the primary issue with healing is that the tuning for healers and all those abilities seems to be designed for ultimate content, and the healer role lacks any meaningful dps rotation. Nerfing or negating a single tank's ability isn't going to change those things. I think bloodwhetting should be seen as a *good* thing because it means the healers would have less healing to do firstly, and secondly with an actual dps rotation they'd be able to spend more time focusing on that. I get that WAR has a hypertuned self-sustain kit but it does trade in other areas. I think if healers got a real rotation for dps (or even a modest one) then they'd be on the boards asking SE for more self-sustain for other classes so they could focus more on their rotation. I think balancing self-sustain with healing kits to give healers something to do would be the best route.

Not to mention the ilvl scaling causing some tanks to dissolve while others are half invincible. In terms of difficulty, it might be best to have duties hard locked to a certain ilvl only a la "min ilvl only" as opposed to saying "min is 635, sync is 655" because god is that a massive spread. It's complicated

What is a single field that WAR sacrifices anything in, regardless, PLD and GNB healing is also off the charts, hell GNB does one of the most beloved healer skills better than the healer who invented it

DPS options should be encouraged but the tanks being immortal is never going to be healthy for the design of the healers

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

To that I will say it again and again and AGAIN: Healer Issues aren't just one, two, or three 'simple fixes' away from proper state. Nobody says removing/nerfing Bloodwhetting alone would've fixed everything. It's only one from many blocks to be chopped, while also being one of the most obvious candidate. If anybody thinks that a Benediction is a cooldown so powerful that only one from four healer receives it with a friggin' 3 minutes cooldown but then a four procs of Benediction to one from four TANK of all roles with only 17s downtime, is seen as a 'good thing'---in a trinity game of all places... then I don't what else to say. What's the point of having the trinity system from first place, then?

We pick healers to heal efficiently & effectively. Why do we want somebody to take over our primary job a.k.a. play the game for us?

At this point it feels like people just not wanting to deal with other's failures. Which is understandable to an extent. But why play a team game, then? Make it make sense.

[Aravell]

I'm not sure where all these people who think the healer role can be fixed by eliminating healing are coming from, but maybe they should just stop.

Regardless, even if we get a complex damage rotation, it doesn't change the fact that we're spending 80% of a savage fight doing something that's not our main role. Tanks spend most of their time doing damage over mitigating as well, but at least it can be said that they're gaining aggro the entire time.

Why can't we be allowed to heal more? Having more complex damage options doesn't preclude having higher healing requirements.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

I'm also trying to understand how could people come to conclusion that healers are designed to 'heal ultimate' when TOP exists lol.

[Saraide]

I'm also trying to understand how could people come to conclusion that healers are designed to 'heal ultimate' when TOP exists lol.

wdym does this not look like a healer to you? /s

[Deceptus]

To that I will say it again and again and AGAIN: Healer Issues aren't just one, two, or three 'simple fixes' away from proper state. Nobody says removing/nerfing Bloodwhetting alone would've fixed everything. It's only one from many blocks to be chopped, while also being one of the most obvious candidate. If anybody thinks that a Benediction is a cooldown so powerful that only one from four healer receives it with a friggin' 3 minutes cooldown but then a four procs of Benediction to one from four TANK of all roles with only 17s downtime, is seen as a 'good thing'---in a trinity game of all places... then I don't what else to say. What's the point of having the trinity system from first place, then?

We pick healers to heal efficiently & effectively. Why do we want somebody to take over our primary job a.k.a. play the game for us?

At this point it feels like people just not wanting to deal with other's failures. Which is understandable to an extent. But why play a team game, then? Make it make sense.

Same with Heart of Corundum. It's better than Recitation (900 potency heal + 15% damage reduction) that's free and available every 25s vs every 45s

Why can't we be allowed to heal more? Having more complex damage options doesn't preclude having higher healing requirements.

Many have asked for just that but the job design team refuses to increase damage to make us heal more.

Mostly because when they did, groups fell apart because they couldn't handle the increased healing required. Mainly caused by non healers (Mostly the DPS) refusing to use mitigation, utilities, and self heals that they've been given.

"Press Feint/ Addle to remove 10% off of that massive bleed that's about to come out? And drift my Rotation by .5s? NO. Oh crap, I'm dead"

[Supersnow845]

Maybe I’m too active on too many pointless 14 “argument” channels (here, reddit, YouTube etc) but has anyone noticed that blowback against changing healer design has seemed to shift from ultra casuals who struggle to heal tam Tara deepcroft to higher end raiders who’s answer to any problem in casual design is “we nothing is balanced around casual”

Maybe it’s just my unique experience but I’ve noticed recently that almost everyone has become unified on the idea that bloodwhetting is too strong (though opinions seem to be mixed on if fixing it for the benefit of the healers is worth a nerf to WAR’s) but the main argument against doing anything with healers now seems to be “yeah bloodwhetting too strong but who the hell cares it’s casual content”

[Aravell]

Maybe I’m too active on too many pointless 14 “argument” channels (here, reddit, YouTube etc) but has anyone noticed that blowback against changing healer design has seemed to shift from ultra casuals who struggle to heal tam Tara deepcroft to higher end raiders who’s answer to any problem in casual design is “we nothing is balanced around casual”

Maybe it’s just my unique experience but I’ve noticed recently that almost everyone has become unified on the idea that bloodwhetting is too strong (though opinions seem to be mixed on if fixing it for the benefit of the healers is worth a nerf to WAR’s) but the main argument against doing anything with healers now seems to be “yeah bloodwhetting too strong but who the hell cares it’s casual content”

Haven't really noticed such a shift myself, but I don't participate in much discussion outside the forums.

I have noticed though, that in the forums, there's been an increase of people who think the only way to fix healers is to eliminate the healing part of healers by allowing every other job to become self-sufficient so we can focus fully on our damage rotation and not be inconvenienced by other people taking damage, which is a bizarre stance to take.

[Saraide]

Maybe I’m too active on too many pointless 14 “argument” channels (here, reddit, YouTube etc) but has anyone noticed that blowback against changing healer design has seemed to shift from ultra casuals who struggle to heal tam Tara deepcroft to higher end raiders who’s answer to any problem in casual design is “we nothing is balanced around casual”

Maybe it’s just my unique experience but I’ve noticed recently that almost everyone has become unified on the idea that bloodwhetting is too strong (though opinions seem to be mixed on if fixing it for the benefit of the healers is worth a nerf to WAR’s) but the main argument against doing anything with healers now seems to be “yeah bloodwhetting too strong but who the hell cares it’s casual content”

I'm someone who has said that in the past because it's not untrue. Jobs arent balanced around casual content. But healing a dark knight in dungeons isnt exactly rocket surgery either so I guess 'who cares it's casual content' works both ways.