The truth is we need a remastered XI or a follow up

[Atelier-Bagur]

Also somebody already called you out on it but the fact that youre using addons in FFXI actually proves my point in how you have to get outside help in order to make the game playable.

Dont be a hypocrite and call people "babies" about not playing the game when you yourself dont even follow the initial game's design (which fyi the ffxi director forgo the mini map feature to make traveling more involved btw...but here you are ignoring it).

Stuff like this pisses me off about people. But anyway yeah, like I said great game, but outside guide is required for full enjoyment.

[Ath192]

Also somebody already called you out on it but the fact that youre using addons in FFXI actually proves my point in how you have to get outside help in order to make the game playable.

Dont be a hypocrite and call people "babies" about not playing the game when you yourself dont even follow the initial game's design (which fyi the ffxi director forgo the mini map feature to make traveling more involved btw...but here you are ignoring it).

Stuff like this pisses me off about people. But anyway yeah, like I said great game, but outside guide is required for full enjoyment.

The game is super outdated, but as you can see the game does have a market for it. People use a ton of add ons for XIV too. It's just not something that's going to stop but it doesn't make it a bad game. Also, people used guides since it came out. The quests give you clues where things are at and you could go at it hardcore for hours finding stuff without a guide, but people didn't operate like that. Guides aren't anything new and people use them all the time for XIV too. Where to unlock things, what mobs drop what items, where to gather.

The thing is, theres a market for it and while a lot of people here wouldn't return to play it, or wouldn't play a new MMO like that, there's plenty of people that would. Thats why having two MMO's catering to two different types of players would be good.

In fact, this two MMO system could be co-developed and share assets. Imagine a parallel XIV with no teleports, no quest markers, a different MSQ but same map and assets, and you get access to both games with one sub, the company saves money on developing assets... I think both would be alive and well TBH.

A lot of people would fall in love with the alternate version and it minimizes the risk since assets are joint.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

The game is super outdated, but as you can see the game does have a market for it. People use a ton of add ons for XIV too. It's just not something that's going to stop but it doesn't make it a bad game. Also, people used guides since it came out. The quests give you clues where things are at and you could go at it hardcore for hours finding stuff without a guide, but people didn't operate like that. Guides aren't anything new and people use them all the time for XIV too. Where to unlock things, what mobs drop what items, where to gather.

The thing is, theres a market for it and while a lot of people here wouldn't return to play it, or wouldn't play a new MMO like that, there's plenty of people that would. Thats why having two MMO's catering to two different types of players would be good.

In fact, this two MMO system could be co-developed and share assets. Imagine a parallel XIV with no teleports, no quest markers, a different MSQ but same map and assets, and you get access to both games with one sub, the company saves money on developing assets... I think both would be alive and well TBH.

A lot of people would fall in love with the alternate version and it minimizes the risk since assets are joint.

Didn't wildstar try to be a more modern old timey mmo? I don't think there's as many people who would go back to a modern version of XI with all it's limitations as people think there are. Didn't XI peak at like 600k subs or something back in it's heyday?

[Ath192]

Didn't wildstar try to be a more modern old timey mmo? I don't think there's as many people who would go back to a modern version of XI with all it's limitations as people think there are. Didn't XI peak at like 600k subs or something back in it's heyday?

Which was a serious accomplishment given some people didn't have internet, you needed to buy a HDD AND MODEM for the PS2 to even play it and gaming PCs and gaming in general weren't as big as they are today. That game had an obscene amount of obstacles. PlayOnline included.

Say XIV had this alternate server and story going on? Do you think it would be dead? I just don't see it.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

Which was a serious accomplishment given some people didn't have internet, you needed to buy a HDD AND MODEM for the PS2 to even play it and gaming PCs and gaming in general weren't as big as they are today. That game had an obscene amount of obstacles. PlayOnline included.

Say XIV had this alternate server and story going on? Do you think it would be dead? I just don't see it.

WoW only came out what, 2 years later? Peak Wow was around the same time as peak XI iirc. I wasn't playing mmos back then, as I was still on dialup until 2006.

[Ath192]

WoW only came out what, 2 years later? Peak Wow was around the same time as peak XI iirc. I wasn't playing mmos back then, as I was still on dialup until 2006.

Blizzard was more famous than XI in general, they released Diablo 2 in 2000 which was massively popular and on top of that focused more on the PC market where as XI and SE in general always prioritized consoles, for which you had to buy said Modem and HDD. TBH the setup was atrocious. It's seriously a miracle it succeeded.

I mean this era you describe is what made Blizzard a household name. Regardless, XI went on to be the most successful game for the FF franchise until XIV took the crown.

[Ath192]

Didn't wildstar try to be a more modern old timey mmo? I don't think there's as many people who would go back to a modern version of XI with all it's limitations as people think there are. Didn't XI peak at like 600k subs or something back in it's heyday?

Everything I've read the game wasn't polished and therefore not good. here's an excerpt:

"The real reason is Wildstar was buggy and had awfully designed systems. Like in ranked PvP, everyone was essentially thrown in together and you would fight people with top gear as a newbie. Endgame dungeons were bugged up the asshole and sometimes it was a 50/50 shot if the boss would spawn or you would have to restart the dungeon. Shit like that kills the playerbase, especially when such a similar experience exists nextdoor in WoW (that was very polished)."

"There was a serious lack of cooperation and cohesion between WildStar dev teams, resulting in half-baked systems (i.e., Paths) that seemed more designed by committee than the result of a focused vision. Too much of the game was all over the place."

[R041]

The game is super outdated, but as you can see the game does have a market for it. People use a ton of add ons for XIV too. It's just not something that's going to stop but it doesn't make it a bad game. Also, people used guides since it came out. The quests give you clues where things are at and you could go at it hardcore for hours finding stuff without a guide, but people didn't operate like that. Guides aren't anything new and people use them all the time for XIV too. Where to unlock things, what mobs drop what items, where to gather..

I don't really want to admit how long it takes me to do each quest. It's pretty insane.

I've even had some where I had to give up, use a guide.. And the guide didn't really help. So there's that. lol

I also had some strange urge to print out the map and plaster it all over the walls, something I haven't done since Ultima. I won't though. Because I'm an adult, and that would be difficult to explain to guests.

The thing I'm enjoying the most right now is I'm given the opportunity to try and fail. Where in XIV I'm very used to just going through the motion of a visual novel where it's nearly impossible to fail. They both have their own strengths, so I'm enjoying XI for the solo challenge.

[Ath192]

I don't really want to admit how long it takes me to do each quest. It's pretty insane.

I've even had some where I had to give up, use a guide.. And the guide didn't really help. So there's that. lol

I also had some strange urge to print out the map and plaster it all over the walls, something I haven't done since Ultima. I won't though. Because I'm an adult, and that would be difficult to explain to guests.

The thing I'm enjoying the most right now is I'm given the opportunity to try and fail. Where in XIV I'm very used to just going through the motion of a visual novel where it's nearly impossible to fail. They both have their own strengths, so I'm enjoying XI for the solo challenge.

I played XI around the time when partying up was mandatory. But honestly what made me fall in love with the game was how dangerous and open the world felt. The adventure aspect really did exist, and the travel. And this despite the world not bieng open, it has zones. And yet it felt huge.

Which, brings me to another aspect. Because of all these systems when there was combat in XI it felt momentous, like, okay stuff is happening because you didn't spend the whole time just blowing stuff up and teleporting. Whereas in XIV because everything has been taken out except combat it feels shallow. Like, okay let's just start blasting with little regard for anything.

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

I played XI around the time when partying up was mandatory. But honestly what made me fall in love with the game was how dangerous and open the world felt. The adventure aspect really did exist, and the travel. And this despite the world not bieng open, it has zones. And yet it felt huge.

Which, brings me to another aspect. Because of all these systems when there was combat in XI it felt momentous, like, okay stuff is happening because you didn't spend the whole time just blowing stuff up and teleporting. Whereas in XIV because everything has been taken out except combat it feels shallow. Like, okay let's just start blasting with little regard for anything.

You can get through all of XIV without teleporting. I did my ng+ run without flying or teleporting.

XIV gives options, which is nice. Heck, if you wanted to, you could go the whole game walking.


I played lineage 2 as my "oldschool" mmo. I loved it then. I would never go back tho. It's outdated, grind as all hell, and while the maps were huge, there was mostly just random mobs everywhere and no real reason to fight most of them.


Heck, even dark souls, the "omg hardcore" game added fast travel in newer releases. It let's you experience the game, instead of spending tons of time getting to the game.

I love exploration, the first time. After the first time, it becomes a chore. Same with puzzles.


The other problem with games like XI releasing now is the internet. We have dedicated teams data mining and spreading every detail of every part of every game now. Day 1 prog is the most fun because there are no guides. Once the guides come out you get pigeon-holed into doing things everyone's favorite content creators way and no other.