Is there too much soy in this game's community

[Kolaina]

Conversely, the perpetually offending may be getting their just reward for years of verbal abuse.

Or they are now the offenders. Commonly referred to as cry bullies. They have a desire to be offensive and vitriolic and use their own version of what’s righteous to excuse their own poor behaviour

[Seraphor]

So, because Skiros didn't specifically say that people can't take constructive criticism, other people aren't allowed to make mention of it? I wasn't aware conversations weren't allowed to grow and evolve. I also wasn't aware you couldn't use a troll thread to address actual issues. /shrug

You can talk about whatever you like, just don't conflate two separate things and try to use an argument form one against the other.

I disagree with bigotry.
I agree with constructive criticism.
It was implied that because I disagree with bigotry, I'm one of the players who can't handle constructive criticism. This is incorrect.
Get it?

[Kolaina]

There's a world of difference between taking offence at someone trying to help you with constructive criticism, and taking offence at a blatantly racist joke.
The fact is, if people don't like what you're saying, they're allowed to disagree with you.

All of this "you can't say anything anymore" bullshit is actually a thinly veiled attempt to censor people who disagree with backwards views. It's telling 'the woke' to shut up and put up with bigotry.

Meanwhile players who get constructive criticism for their performance, and take it badly, are likely that way because they've become used to other players being aggressive and judgemental. As I said, these are actually entirely opposite issues. Players get defensive about their performance because of aggressive, highly competitive players who try to police everything.
They shouldn't get defensive about constructive criticism, but they shouldn't have to get defensive either.

You keep jumping to racism and bigotry. If you’re seeing this everywhere then maybe it’s you. Keep trying to argue with me over an issue I’m not addressing,

I said “cant criticize or say anything that makes a person have a negative emotion”

Your response “racism, sexism, bigotry”

Your responses have nothing to do with what I’m referring to. You’re using buzzwords to excuse your crap attitude and to justify your negative responses. This is the same attitude and justification the cry bullies I refer to use.

You can’t make a legitimate claim or criticism without an individual such as yourself charging in like “but it’s worse!!! Ree ree ree”.

[Seraphor]

You keep jumping to racism and bigotry. If you’re seeing this everywhere then maybe it’s you. Keep trying to argue with me over an issue I’m not addressing,

I said “cant criticize or say anything that makes a person have a negative emotion”

Your response “racism, sexism, bigotry”

Your responses have nothing to do with what I’m referring to. You’re using buzzwords to excuse your crap attitude and to justify your negative responses. This is the same attitude and justification the cry bullies I refer to use.

You can’t make a legitimate claim or criticism without an individual such as yourself charging in like “but it’s worse!!! Ree ree ree”.

What is going on, is you're making an argument for 'criticising things'.
Which I don't disagree with.

But the TC very clearly was referring to making offensive jokes, which means "racism, sexism, homophobia, bigotry, etc".

I was arguing against the TC's quite obvious trolling. You've decided to use me as an example of people who argue against giving criticism.

If I'm arguing over an issue you're not addressing, maybe you should have read the TC's first post a little more closely and not used my argument against bigotry as an example in your completely different argument.

To top it off, you're now referring to people on one side of one of these arguments as 'cry bullies'. Are you referring to me? I have no idea, because you conflated the two arguments. This is how offense ends up being taken.

Ironically, you're now characterising me with things like "Reeeee", when I haven't once lost my cool.
You see, you are the one getting defensive in response to cool-headed counterarguments right now.
You are a case study in why people get offended by things online. Because text doesn't convey tone of voice, or emotion.

[Midareyukki]

You guys need a hug ♥



Don't lose control over the troll, ok?

[sumi__]

*not this thread turning into arguments lmao*

Anywho.
To the original point, which was about banter and "silly little insults" and such, if you're gonna insult someone don't be surprised if they say "hey don't say rude things bc it's really just not funny". If you're trying to make a joke, make it something under the umbrella of funny. Being mean to someone though and trying to play it off as lighthearted or funny? It's still being mean, just with an excuse added to it.

To the not-original point, where the thread derailed, yes some people get hurt by constructive criticism. It's a fact. We can complain about it as much as we'd like, but if people are insecure about how they're doing and then someone says something with an ambiguous tone calling them out, they will feel embarrassed and respond harshly. It's just the way a lot of humans are.

People become foolish though when they take these 'clapbacks' to heart, or take to heart one person being rude, or take it personally when someone gives a suggestion or their opinion on something you're doing.

If you get hurt by constructive criticism: Don't take it to heart! 99 times out of 100, they're just trying to help you a little bit or are offering some insight about something. They're just trying to be helpful, even if you aren't looking for help. And if you don't want help, why waste your time and effort typing out something rude back? Just say "ok!" or "noted!" and move on with life. No one has to be a jerk, no one gets hurt, and literally, it's the right way to resolve it. If you are looking for help but are embarrassed, just say thank you! There's nothing wrong with making mistakes, I personally have made soooo many and now I feel super confident on a bunch of jobs. Just takes time and being open to feedback.

If you enjoy derrogatory jokes: Grow up. Lol. Not to be mean but uhm... it's like the equivalent of saying "you're a poopy face", I mean sure but no?

If you are trying to help someone but they hit you with a mean reply: Don't take it to heart, and just move on. It's very kind you were trying to help, and most people will happily take your feedback and roll with it, and try to learn. It's only the people who aren't looking to grow as a person/as a player who will be rude, and so they aren't even worth being offended by. You said your piece, it's up to them now if they take it and grow, or if they decide to be rude and ignore you. You did your part.

Something overall though for this thread- there's two arguments going on here, it's probably (it is) best to clarify which one you're talking about, and recognize the split.

All this from a troll post though

[Kolaina]

What is going on, is you're making an argument for 'criticising things'.
Which I don't disagree with.

But the TC very clearly was referring to making offensive jokes, which means "racism, sexism, homophobia, bigotry, etc".

I was arguing against the TC's quite obvious trolling. You've decided to use me as an example of people who argue against giving criticism.

If I'm arguing over an issue you're not addressing, maybe you should have read the TC's first post a little more closely and not used my argument against bigotry as an example in your completely different argument.

And then I brought up a valid point.

While I referred to you by saying not everything is about the buzzwords you used, people are still too easily offended.

Then you came at me with buzzwords calling “you can’t say anything anymore” bs while suggesting it’s anti woke.

If you want to address actual sexism, racism etc then fine, fight the good fight. But don’t come at me with your buzzwords when I’m doing none of that. If you want to see those things everywhere, you will. But you become the problem when you’re looking for it.

But people need to grow a spine. Get thicker skin. Not every criticism is a personal attack or life ending. But the community, at least the vocal community is starting to swing their reactions in that direction. Simultaneously acting with a behaviour they claim they are fighting against

[Necrotica]

The key with all offensive comedy is to be the demographic you are making fun of. And on the internet you can be every demographic at once. So make jokes freely and whenever someone complains say you are part of x group so it is okay.

Identity politics are here to stay so lets abuse them like a drunk step dad.

((I can make this joke since I am a drunk step dad.))

[Seraphor]

And then I brought up a valid point.

While I referred to you by saying not everything is about the buzzwords you used, people are still too easily offended.

Then you came at me with buzzwords calling “you can’t say anything anymore” bs while suggesting it’s anti woke.

If you want to address actual sexism, racism etc then fine, fight the good fight. But don’t come at me with your buzzwords when I’m doing none of that. If you want to see those things everywhere, you will. But you become the problem when you’re looking for it.

But people need to grow a spine. Get thicker skin. Not every criticism is a personal attack or life ending. But the community, at least the vocal community is starting to swing their reactions in that direction. Simultaneously acting with a behaviour they claim they are fighting against

Do you want to go back and re-read my posts?

I was giving you both arguments, and why you should not conflate them. And yet you still somehow managed to miss the point and assumed I was using the bigotry argument against you. 'Coming at you with "buzzwords" and the like.'
I didn't accuse you of being bigoted, or being in favour of bigotry. But you did seem to jump to the short-sighted defence of the Troll TC, who was referring to being bigoted.

If you're going to come back with more accusations against me I'm just leaving it here. Because, it's so ironic, you keep getting offended by my posts, when I'm not meaning to offend you.

[Kolaina]

Do you want to go back and re-read my posts?

I was giving you both arguments, and why you should not conflate them. And yet you still somehow managed to miss the point and assumed I was using the bigotry argument against you.
I didn't accuse you of being bigoted, or being in favour of bigotry. But you did seem to jump to the short-sighted defence of the Troll TC, who was referring to being bigoted.

You conflated them. At me. Called my part “bs” saying it’s used to justify the other. This is all on you making a mountain out of a molehill. Trying to fight multiple fronts. Point the finger at yourself