Dark Knight Megathread

[Shurrikhan]

I think that if you're going to take issue with a job's core gameplay loop, then you are obliged to be specific in your feedback. Turning Dark Mind into Rampart isn't going to put 'spice' into DRK. Reducing the acquisition level of Dark Missionary isn't going to give it a defining identity. The reason why complaints like yours are an actual problem is that if the dev team actually decides that the job needs to be reworked but have no useful player feedback on how to do so, we could end up in an even worse state than Stormblood. It's like playing roulette with the job. If you don't know what you want for dinner, stick with the set menu.

This kind of feels like being ticked that a customer didn't well enough specify how they wanted their food itself prepared when they've asked merely that it be served on a plate...

All that's ultimately been said so far is that little differences like Dark Mind or Living Dead are not sufficient to form an identity. That doesn't seem particularly controversial. And while I'd agree with you that those small differences are better than none, and so I wouldn't take from their insufficiency that they are disposable, nothing in Rune's posts indicates that they wish only to remove those insufficient bits and stop there; they've made pretty clear that removal would only be done as/if part of a larger cohesive rework. That's very distant from, say, the Stormblood era complaints, each complete in themselves, about "DA spam" or a "lackluster capstone CD" in Delirium.

Over the last few pages, what gameplay loops and considerations would feel most appropriate to or synergetic with DRK's themes has already been in debate. You've suggested a Reaper-esque second combo implementation. Others have suggested a more Huton/Surging-esque second combo. Arch has suggested a many-spender-option Darkside state option in place of a second combo. Others have focused on altogether different areas. Marking a tentative line for how far one feels we ought to go before we can remotely pat ourselves on the back does not make one suddenly responsible for coming up with each concrete implementation in that direction. This all still in flux; let it breathe. When Rune has some spitball implementations for us, I'm sure she'll post them and we can then discuss them as a thread as we've done for those before.

Gotcha, I misinterpreted "MP refreshing statuses have no effect" as you couldn't regen MP at all so I thought maybe you had to flip it [Darkside] off occasionally.

I think that was true, actually, at least while in combat? If you got an old Ewer card back then while in Darkside (much like a BLM in Astral Fire), it not only wouldn't tick, but it'd count you as immune to receiving the effect altogether, iirc. It's been a long time, though.

[Archwizard]

I feel like the idea of Darkside as a "disable MP recovery for a substantial boost in damage" effect has been coopted by PLD's Requiescat, in a certain sense, due to how the latter consumes large amounts of MP all at once for a damage burst.
Obviously the mechanics are very different, but the effect on gameplay is generally similar in an environment where external sources of MP regeneration have been removed anyway.

Not that I've seen anyone suggest a return to it in so many words, of course.

I think that was true, actually, at least while in combat? If you got an old Ewer card back then while in Darkside (much like a BLM in Astral Fire), it not only wouldn't tick, but it'd count you as immune to receiving the effect altogether, iirc. It's been a long time, though.

I distinctly remember foolishly Manashifting onto a DRK as a baby BLM who didn't yet understand any other job because I saw their MP had been exhausted, only for them to be Immune to it. Good times.

[Shurrikhan]

I distinctly remember foolishly Manashifting onto a DRK as a baby BLM who didn't yet understand any other job because I saw their MP had been exhausted, only for them to be Immune to it. Good times.

Same, but with Astral Fire. I wanted so badly for Manashifting from other casters back onto BLM just after they'd already used Flare to be a thing. Would it be damn powerful, especially in dungeons? Sure. But it'd also require careful tracking on the other casters' part to give the MP to the BLM at the right time anyways.