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  1. #1
    Player
    Gaethan_Tessula's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2019
    Location
    Gridania
    Posts
    222
    Character
    Gaethan Tessula
    World
    Adamantoise
    Main Class
    Blue Mage Lv 70
    Quote Originally Posted by Shurrikhan View Post
    BLU's kit presently sucks without enemy weaknesses...

    What you do instead then is offload a large portion of the impact those mechanics from the mobs' characteristics to the BLU's own mechanics.
    I'm entirely up for improving BLU's rotation. Assuming there is room to fit it into available spell-slots, I certainly agree that rotating between elements via applying weaknesses from one type to another would be better gameplay between-burst than we have now.

    As for the meme spells (e.g., lvl 5 Death), in a world with unlimited BLU, they could probably be safely consigned to be Carnivale only, or otherwise restricted somehow. Trying to give 128+ spells on one job unique niches in regular content is probably futile.

    ____________

    Quote Originally Posted by Shurrikhan View Post
    On the contrary, it could greatly improve the available depths of its rotation and freedoms of skill choice precisely by giving it that increased balance that would ready it for full access to content. Put quite simply, the majority of the work is just replacing lazy design, where present, with actual internal balance.
    In an ideal world, I'm sure it could, and I would enjoy that.

    In this one, I just don't find it likely the devs would put in the needed effort and upkeep. Were BLU to become an unlimited job, they'd more likely raze BLU as-is to the ground. It's just easier to create a job that fits cleanly into the established design parameters, than to constantly struggle with one that doesn't (unless set it aside from the current endgame, which is what they've done). The flexibility that endears BLU to me is, in my opinion, safer as a limited job for which balance is no concern.

    Quote Originally Posted by Reinha View Post
    So what if it's different in Duty Finder? It's already different in the sense that it can't participate. Do you want no one to have the choice to join DF with a predetermined set of spells just because you prefer Party Finder?
    That's a rather silly bias to presume I would have. But no, my actual reasons are:

    1. BLU's current core identity is being able to granularly adjust its kit and role between instances (and, to a much lesser degree, in-instance). Developing a fixed kit for DF directly contradicts that core-identity. The devs would have to settle for picking one of BLU's sub-identities defined by the three extreme corners of its role selection: flute-burst, oGCD, and weakness-targeting DPS; ARR WHM, including Stoneskin II, but with more damage buttons; and a tank that uses actively cast mitigations, along with abilities that "reflect" damage back at the target (Chel' Gate, Veil of the Whorl, Cold Fog, etc.). Probably the DPS one exclusively since that's what BLU would queue as, unless they actually find a way for BLU to actually count as a healer or tank in terms of mechanics.

    I somehow think that BLU having to play the "diet coke" version of itself to use DF would continue to cause displeasure in the playerbase. Furthermore, locked-kits in DF would have a knockon of making it harder to balance BLU for current content; e.g., if the devs balance around their DF BLU, then PF BLU could be too strong. This would be especially problematic on JP servers, where DF is actually used for harder content.

    2. Making the two distinct, and the DF set likely suboptimal, creates a perverse incentive for players to not use Duty Finder. I've already seen some people complain that BLU as is made it harder to participate in the moogle-tome events as other classes, since so many went to BLU-burn parties in Party Finder. Permanently instituting this problem via having unequal DF and PF BLU as full jobs seems like something SE would want to avoid, as Duty Finder is the primary means by which new players progress through the game.

    ____________

    Overall, I think people are underestimating how much extra work it would be to adapt BLU's current flexibility and logistical considerations (e.g., needing to create several different spell-loadouts and hotbar configurations) into coherence with the rest of the game's design. Especially when the alternatives are the present "balance? who cares, it's side content" or ripping out the customization to create a curated kit a-la any other job (where some people gain caster DPS #4, and everyone who enjoys BLU as it is now loses everything).

    Could it hypothetically be done? Yes.

    Would I like for it to be done? Yes.

    Do I trust that Square Enix Business Division 5 has the will or capability to pull it off? No. If healer design ever gets better, maybe I'll change my mind.
    (1)
    Last edited by Gaethan_Tessula; 02-12-2022 at 12:45 PM.

  2. #2
    Player
    Reinha's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2015
    Location
    Finland
    Posts
    4,101
    Character
    Reinha Sorrowmoon
    World
    Odin
    Main Class
    Reaper Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Gaethan_Tessula View Post
    That's a rather silly bias to presume I would have. But no, my actual reasons are:

    1. BLU's current core identity is being able to granularly adjust its kit and role between instances (and, to a much lesser degree, in-instance). Developing a fixed kit for DF directly contradicts that core-identity. The devs would have to settle for picking one of BLU's sub-identities defined by the three extreme corners of its role selection: flute-burst, oGCD, and weakness-targeting DPS; ARR WHM, including Stoneskin II, but with more damage buttons; and a tank that uses actively cast mitigations, along with abilities that "reflect" damage back at the target (Chel' Gate, Veil of the Whorl, Cold Fog, etc.). Probably the DPS one exclusively since that's what BLU would queue as, unless they actually find a way for BLU to actually count as a healer or tank in terms of mechanics.

    I somehow think that BLU having to play the "diet coke" version of itself to use DF would continue to cause displeasure in the playerbase. Furthermore, locked-kits in DF would have a knockon of making it harder to balance BLU for current content; e.g., if the devs balance around their DF BLU, then PF BLU could be too strong. This would be especially problematic on JP servers, where DF is actually used for harder content.

    2. Making the two distinct, and the DF set likely suboptimal, creates a perverse incentive for players to not use Duty Finder. I've already seen some people complain that BLU as is made it harder to participate in the moogle-tome events as other classes, since so many went to BLU-burn parties in Party Finder. Permanently instituting this problem via having unequal DF and PF BLU as full jobs seems like something SE would want to avoid, as Duty Finder is the primary means by which new players progress through the game.
    Your reasons didn't explain why players who like using the DF shouldn't be allowed to use it as BLU.

    1. If you don't like being forced in the caster role as BLU, you can still use the PF. As for it causing "displeasure", those angry people can also just use the PF. This just sounds like a lame excuse to deny us what we are requesting. Or bias, as you put it. It has nothing to do with balance because a DF spell kit only requires 24-36 spells and BLU already has that many normal, unimpressive spells. The rest can be as imbalanced as they are since wouldn't be a part of the DF kit.

    2. If you find the DF set suboptimal, don't use it. The people complaining about BLUs only using PF during moogle events seem like a good reason to let BLUs pick DF if they want and keep those queues active. I mean... banning BLUs from DF is a bad incentive for them to use DF.
    (5)
    Last edited by Reinha; 02-13-2022 at 07:31 PM.
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