Summoner rework is a huge dissapointment

[Aikaal]

I am curious has se or any community representative responded officially about the smn changes and all the concerned threads about the drastic changes ? And if the very low dps is indeed intended ?

You can reduce pet size but if you keep your party members visual effects, you'll get flash bang on every summon lol.

You are not entitled to a "community representative response" just because you're upset about a rework that was 8 years overdue, goodness. They might briefly touch on buffs to Summoner during the part 1 6.1 LL in March, if even that. Keep your expectations reasonable.

I'm not to SMN specifically but I believe the community should know why MNK got the same fire power buff than MCH. When they were doing 1k more. There's like 20 threads on this forum about how SMN is an issue. The silence, is a problem. 6.08 was the perfect opportunity to give some insurance and it only made it worst.

I don't expect anything. I'm already playing something else because I don't expect SMN to get fixed until 7.0. I'm just being very realist that this is Melee Fantasy & Black Mage XIV. Because that's what the long silence and buffs are telling me right now.

*Edit*

This isn't just for Summoner. Machinist and White Mage are in pretty bad spots right now. Red Mage isn't faring better and Ranged Physical is the least played job because nobody wants to play a weak archetype. So yeah, if there was news on what they're planning to do, maybe people would stick to the suffering.

[Sequora]

Hoping to get answers at the live letter in a few weeks. Honestly I couldn’t care less about their “planned content for the next 10 years”.

I want them to at least admit that SMN damage is low because they have rez, and mobility.

[aveyond-dreams]

The upcoming live letter is explicitly about the future of FFXIV as a whole for the next ten years-it is not the place for discussions on job balancing which changes from patch to patch or in some cases expansion to expansion. We can expect a lot of fluff and discussion about potential themes or locations they want to explore and what characters will be joining us, or possibly technical or systemic upgrades they plan to do. Doubtless this will not stop people from spamming twitch chat asking for things like Viera hair or Dark Knight reworks, but I suppose that's to be expected.

The live letter where they will touch on the topic if they so choose is the 6.1 part 1 live letter, likely happening in March. Perhaps they might even leave that until the part 2 live letter, who knows. Silence is the way they have always chosen to operate, for better or for worse. No one had any expectation of male Viera happening until they popped out of literally nowhere in the last fanfest, nor was I expecting Summoner to receive a rework at all until they came out and explained everything during the job changes live letter.

In any case, I do not foresee any drastic changes coming in the near future. Reasonable improvements that won't disrupt the fun that the majority are now having could happen, and reversions back to what clearly wasn't working are not. Adjustments to Summoner's Raise will happen one way or the other, though I believe they will at some point delete it from our kit in favor of something else. I expect to see more streamlining of jobs in the future, hopefully Samurai gets some of its button bloat taken care of at last and Bard can finally become a real Bard instead of a mystic archer, but I'm not expecting any of that until 7.0.

[IruruCece]

You are not entitled to a "community representative response" just because you're upset about a rework that was 8 years overdue, goodness.

You're not entitled to having any of your BS taken seriously in any single thread you post in, but here you are again.

[Reinha]

I want them to at least admit that SMN damage is low because they have rez, and mobility.

Isn't it common sense though? Why would a party pick any other job if they can pick a job with a raise, heals, instant casts and a long range, who can attack from anywhere in the arena while moving and still do good damage? SMN should be at the bottom with RDM.

[Rika007]

Isn't it common sense though? Why would a party pick any other job if they can pick a job with a raise, heals, instant casts and a long range, who can attack from anywhere in the arena while moving and still do good damage? SMN should be at the bottom with RDM.

1. Because the 1% role bonus will always insure that everyone is represented.

2. Because mobility, healing and raise means absolutely nothing to most parties after 2 or 3 weeks of progression (if that). You don't balance a job based on how it plays when everyone is at there worst.

[Reinha]

1. Because the 1% role bonus will always insure that everyone is represented.

2. Because mobility, healing and raise means absolutely nothing to most parties after 2 or 3 weeks of progression (if that). You don't balance a job based on how it plays when everyone is at there worst.

You only need 3 jobs to get the bonus. What about the 4th dps slot? Why should a job that can't save a run have lower dps than a job who can? All jobs should be close to each other but someone has to be at the bottom and it should be the jobs with the best utility.

[aveyond-dreams]

Well then I look forward to the reactions on the 18th/19th when some of the more frequent Summoner complainers are shocked to discover that the purpose of the live letter was to discuss literally everything else except job balancing. The option to acknowledge the present reality remains an option, however.

The only time I can remember where *forum* outrage along with outrage across all other social media sites was when male Viera weren't revealed and the playerbase was surprised with Hrothgar instead. They responded to that fairly quickly given that a 1000-liked post on a support thread popped up out of nowhere, the numbers of which aren't seen here.

[Rika007]

I get Why Phoenix does more damage but it further shows it makes little sense.
- Phoenix is 80 and Bahamut 70, Phoenix was lesset DPS than Bahamut so you'd get a damage loss so they fixed it by just giving damage to Phoenix. This concept is a flaw in terms of lore. You make Phoenix stronger because it wouldn't make sense but Bahamut is, quite literally, the 7th calamity in your lore and provides more destruction.

Leaving the rest of your post aside because that has some good ideas and points, there is just as much a valid lore reason for Pheonix to be more powerful than Bahamut. Pheonix is the primal that literally blew a hole through Bahamut's chest, as Louisouix became the Pheonix primal and defeated Bahamut. Bahamut only was able to bring Pheonix under its control because Loisoux thought the battle was won and relinquished his control of the power, and Bahamut used the last vestiges of it's power to latch onto the Pheonix aether and temper him.

Now leaving the lore aside I do agree that Summoner's support kit needs some reworking. Making Radiant Aegis, Everlasting Flight, Rekindle all useable at any moment within the fight would remove a lot of Frustration and provide a nice little bit of fun to the job. I personally would also love for Radiant Aegis to gain a 3rd Charge and be useable around not just self, but other Party Members, as that would provide for some great opportunities to assist the raid with. (This all being said it does have the side effect of absolutely just making healers matter even less, but that's an entire other conversation).

A rework to Resurrections for RDM and SMN (or outright removal) is also long overdue and desparately needed. If it does stay around. Then an instant cast 2 minute long cooldown would probably be the best bet. I also wouldn't mind some additional flavor added on with maybe a reskin of the spell to be Pheonix like, as the bird literally is all about Ressurection, some fire and feathers springing forth when you use it would be cool.

All this would of course also need something given to Pheonix to make up for the loss of Rekindle, and simply put the only option is another oGCD attack, and you would want to at least try to not just hand it another Revelation, death flare, akh morn, attack dropping from the sky. This would require an animation change which we know only happens during expansions, but I wouldn't mind this being the spot that Summoner get's its first line AoE to represent the rush mechanics in Turn 12, Scorched Pinion.

Do all this and up the oGCD count as well and SMN will feel much better. Get back to 2 Akh Morns/Revelations during the trance phase, get aetherflow back to a 30 second cooldown. Maybe also bring back Pheonix 1-2 GCD combo. I fully admit I do preffer this version of Summoner over Shadowbringers, which I absolutely loathed, but I'm also not blind to the issues. The job needs more, and I think the oGCD department is where it starts. It feels very much like Stormblood Red Mage to me, very bare and simplistic and just missing things, like the dev team was worried that if they put in too much mechanics they'd have nothing to give in the future. Which hey if it follows the same track then I guess we have a near perfect job in 8.0, because while it took them nearly 5 years, Red Mage finally feels truly perfected. Although I wouldn't begrudge anyone for thinking that is too long (cause it is.)

[Rika007]

You only need 3 jobs to get the bonus. What about the 4th dps slot? Why should a job that can't save a run have lower dps than a job who can? All jobs should be close to each other but someone has to be at the bottom and it should be the jobs with the best utility.

I'm sorry but why should they be? Why should the best utility jobs be near the bottom? That's such an arbitrary reason, just as arbitrary as saying, the best mobility, or the easiest rotation, or the least amount of party synergy mechanics. And also is not one that's easily quantified. Reaper has great utility. Monk has solid utility. Hell I would say that both Black Mage and Samurai have more 'utility' then Machinist, yet if you were to suddenly put Machinist damage on par with theirs, I'm sure you get massive blow back from a good part of the community.

The community doesn't even agree on what makes up utility. Some say it's anything that contributes to buffing the damage, mitigation, or healing of others. Some say that damage shouldn't be included in that. Some say its bringing any ability that makes the job of others easier. Balancing around such a nebulous statistic only causes issues.

And also your question still doesn't address the problem of "What happens when the run doesnt need to be saved?" aka 90% of the time we play this game. After a few weeks, almost every piece of content in this game becomes trivial, save ultimate. When that utility means absolutely nothing, it should no longer be factored into balance.