Summoner Needs to be buffed

[PotatoGirl]

There's a number of people that have been sincerely asking for changes where the end result would be needing to hardcast ruin 3 more, which makes me think there's quite a few people that just don't get the new summoner rotation. Or maybe they only have 80~90% uptime or something...

We're already casting a whole bunch of different flavors of ruin with our summons why would you want to hard cast ruin III
thats just no pls stop that line of thinking. Im begging. Why are people like this.

I'd simply be happy if phoenix wasnt a dps loss since you go from deathflare every minute to every two once you hit 80. dunno how they missed that when remaking the job but they did. But hey at least I get a totally not useless HoT every 2 min. Hooray. I'm so useful now my low dps is justified.

[dinnertime]

Casting Ruin 3 more than once is not a bad thing if you think about it. If they made the 4 summon commands oGCD, you can essentially squeeze in three Ruin 3's and one Bahamut/Phoenix Ruin per minute instead of just one Ruin 3 which *is* a DPS increase... at the expense of mobility.

It's really not a needed change, but it's not also the end of the world if a change like this does happen.

[Atmaweapon510]

I don’t get why people keep complaining about Phoenix. Would people like it if 500 total potency was shaved off somewhere else to make room for it? I actually like that dichotomy where Bahamut has better damage while Phoenix has healing. Phoenix even comes at the capstone level of a previous expansion, meaning you pretty much never feel any sort of “damage drop” as you also immediately get an ilvl spike.

Now if summoner needs potency increases, just give it potency increases. Maybe halve the cooldown of energy drain so that smn has more than one button to press most of the time.

[RocciaSolida]

I don’t get why people keep complaining about Phoenix. Would people like it if 500 total potency was shaved off somewhere else to make room for it? I actually like that dichotomy where Bahamut has better damage while Phoenix has healing. Phoenix even comes at the capstone level of a previous expansion, meaning you pretty much never feel any sort of “damage drop” as you also immediately get an ilvl spike.

Now if summoner needs potency increases, just give it potency increases. Maybe halve the cooldown of energy drain so that smn has more than one button to press most of the time.

1. Phoenix deals less damage than Bahamut, which you acquire an expansion earlier
2. Phoenix's utility is an illusion since you're not gonna delay it to heal when it's needed (and you can't move it up either, but you wouldn't do it anyway)
3. Phoenix is a reskin of Bahamut since it works the exact same, great creativity there

And yes, Phoenix comes at a capstone but makes you lose a bit of damage, the ilvl spike argument doesn't make sense. Every job gets one at 50/60/70/80/90 but SMN is the only one that has this weird dps drop when acquiring a supposedly good trait

[Shurrikhan]

I don’t get why people keep complaining about Phoenix. Would people like it if 500 total potency was shaved off somewhere else to make room for it? I actually like that dichotomy where Bahamut has better damage while Phoenix has healing. Phoenix even comes at the capstone level of a previous expansion, meaning you pretty much never feel any sort of “damage drop” as you also immediately get an ilvl spike.

It's the same complaint as given back in HW for Wheeling Thrust. Prior to level 58, Dragoons could pre-position for their positionals, since they could only proc Fang & Claw. After 58, they had a 50% chance each of proccing F&C or WT, meaning they could no longer pre-position, but they had no higher damage to reward them for doing so. The level-up was quite objectively a nerf. The same mostly applies here.

Phoenix costs the Summoner potency for what will 99% of the time will be useless minor utility. If there was choice involved, that might be okay, but there isn't. If the same level-up gave (through toolkit, not just gear access) a net gain in potency over time, that might be okay, but it doesn't.

[PotatoGirl]

I don’t get why people keep complaining about Phoenix. Would people like it if 500 total potency was shaved off somewhere else to make room for it? I actually like that dichotomy where Bahamut has better damage while Phoenix has healing. Phoenix even comes at the capstone level of a previous expansion, meaning you pretty much never feel any sort of “damage drop” as you also immediately get an ilvl spike.

Now if summoner needs potency increases, just give it potency increases. Maybe halve the cooldown of energy drain so that smn has more than one button to press most of the time.

Said it a few pages ago, will say it again, the heal is not worth it.
The utility it provides is not reliable. Losing damage for a mediocre, unreliable HoT is not good job design. There was no "room" that needed to be made for it. It could co-exist with a phoenix version of deathflare very easily.

[Kolsykol]

Not gonna lie I thought the heal on Phoenix was a damage ability and kept using it as such.
It never even crossed my mind that they'd do something as dumb as add a healing skill to Phoenix lol.

I mean I get it thematically, but such a situational heal is just ridiculous.
So ridiculous that I just took for granted it was two damage ones like on Bahamut.

[Nizzi]

SMN's Physick should upgrade into Phoenix's heal and then Astral Flow should become a "phoenix deathflare", very stupid design that Phoenix is functionally worse than Bahamut for DPS despite being a level 80 capstone skill. Physick is absolutely useless otherwise, and it'd actually give some meaning to why Summoner still has this useless button past being an Arcanist. Heck, even allow it to be on a timer outside of your Phoenix phase and have it be available for 60 seconds or something, giving it more functionality and usage.

[VorpalSpork]

What I'd like is for Phoenix to change Physic to an instant, higher potency, heal, with say, 30 second duration. That lets you use it a bit more situationally. Then, have the current heal be something like a "phoenix deathflare". Keeps the healing, but makes phoenix not be this strange dps loss phase.

[remiff]

The phoenix healing spell is rather useless except on dungeon packs but too situational to be a good spell,
but also very unpleasant to use, and nothing justifies the fact that phoenix receives a healing except flavor for identity, we are dps and not healers,
if they wanted to add a spell, it had to be added as a stack spell that was gained in each phoenix, with no time limit and which replaces physik,
actually pheonix burst is weak compare to bahamut, and that was a bad job disign for sure .

Anyway, the Summoner still needs a little 6.1 rework,
and not only for phoenix, but also to make the buff usable out of combat / during summons and also for the shield,
because remove attacks from pets because their ai is bad and add as much restriction to the use of 2 simple utility spells, is just thoughtless and stupid.

Already I have the impression that the summoner is a half job that suffers from a cruel lack of spells and a cruel lack of resource management,
the concept is good but feels incomplete as if they had half reworked this job, it will necessarily be better at 7.0 but devs hasn't really done a great job, too much concept error.