I'm gonna say something unpopular: I don't like to rush.

[Penthea]

Yes it is truly amazing given in 99 percent of the duties i run the only thing people say are Hi (and that's not a given for everyone) and thank you for the party but we all know some can read minds and know what everyone wants. I will admit that on some occassions the tank asks the healer if large pulls are ok but that doesn't happen very often. I've never seen in all my years playing this game a party vote on what the pull size should be in any duty I've run.

A lot of the time people say nothing out of not wanting to rock the boat, not because they are actually happy with whatever it is that's happening.

Especially true if they're a dps because they often have to wait quite a long time to even get inside the instance. The last thing they want is to get kicked or have the group disband and have to go through a long queue again.

Certainly for myself I have often kept my mouth shut if I'm being made to do something I don't like. I often just don't feel it's worth potentially starting an argument and stalling the instance if I can manage to do whatever it is even if I really am not enjoying myself.

[Canadane]

I will do the biggest pulls I can manage, and I will pump out as much DPS as I can while maintaining aggro

I don't understand this though.
In most dungeons, especially level cap dungeons, the biggest pull you can manage is just about everything up to the wall. Usually very few exceptions.
Enmity is also basically a non-issue, ShB made it so everything a tank does will generate it.

[Doozer]

Except for the fact that on a group game, everyone making a similar effort > one player riding on the others efforts.

But I forgot some people still think this a single player game and the other 3 players are just bots.

I see, you're just pulling arguments out of a hat to have a reason to talk to me. I'm flattered. I don't recall ever saying it's a single player game and that the other three players are bots, but I'd love for you to quote me when I did. Maybe I'm misremembering. Perhaps it was in a thread about strawman arguments?

[JohnSpawnVFX]

I see, you're just pulling arguments out of a hat to have a reason to talk to me. I'm flattered. I don't recall ever saying it's a single player game and that the other three players are bots, but I'd love for you to quote me when I did. Maybe I'm misremembering. Perhaps it was in a thread about strawman arguments?

I was wondering when you'd pull the victim and persecution cards

Statements have consequences. Just because you aren't aware of them doesn't mean they don't exist. Just because you didn't mention those consequences, doesn't mean they don't exist,

Lol the person who keeps saying anyone responding to them is out to get them is talking about strawman arguments? You are misremembering your own posting history.

[Doozer]

I was wondering when you'd pull the victim and persecution cards

Oh now it's just sad. Fight with yourself, then you'll always win. I'm not playing with you, pal.

[WaxSw]

This is the wrong metaphor. Because:

1. In fact, there is no speed limits for the dungeons.

2. Unlike a highway, there are only four of you and you can easily negotiate the speed.

3. Nobody's real safety or life depends on the speed of the run.

4. You can always leave this road and nothing will happen.

1. You could say that the walls in most dungeon act as speed limits (and then you have anyder's first pull)

2. Therefore why I said that if you want to do something outside the norm you communicate with your party.

3. True that no one is risking their life but in the metaphor we could say that the crash is having your party being fed up with what you're doing, not a literal crash

4. Same as 3 this is a game you there are things that can't be directly translated to the road metaphor but that doesn't change the underlying meaning.

In the end I repeat, rush is the meta for a reason, its widely accepted as the most optimal playstyle and the norm, its fine if you don't like it but if you want to do something else try to make sure your party doesn't care about the speed of the run and are fine going slower don't force them to do something they don't want, communication is key

[linayar]

Huh?
The bit about using defensive cooldowns wasn't even directed towards you and was just more a general sense on why people question why people are so bad or why its accepted.
Just pointed out the common things you see from bad players.


Though I do love how you always ignore my whole post just to point out one thing.
Just so you have something to say.


Now this WAS directed towards you.
You're ok with people pulling only single packs of mobs, which is why I said you're ok with people playing like garbage if you're so hell bent on thinking that's ok, when mobs hit like a wet noodle even when you're decently geared for said dgn.
Gonna say its fair to assume you tank like this, as I don't think "good" tanks would defend this sort of lazy play.
If you're playing a tank in a endgame dungeon or a dungeon WAY Past the ARR stages.
But I guess you want HoN to teach people how to pull a large mobs?

I didn't ignore your whole post as it just boils down to making a strawman argument, just like this one.

I think focusing on one mob in a pack is playing badly, but I disagree that pulling a single pack is playing badly.

[Vahlnir]

I think focusing on one mob in a pack is playing badly, but I disagree that pulling a single pack is playing badly.

Playing badly? I don't think so either. Playing optimally? Probably not, no. A lot of people prefer optimal play, myself included. Pulling everything you can and AoEing them all down is no doubt the best way. When I'm not tanking (which is actually pretty rare nowadays) and I'm playing as a dps...small pulls like that annoy me, but I also accept that not everyone is able to or is willing to pull wall to wall for whatever reasons they have. As much as it may annoy me, sometimes that is simply how it's going to play out.

[Gemina]

Now, if your unfamiliar with the dungeon and now sure how far to take your pulls. Just say "Im new to this dungeon, Ill try large pulls but we are probably gonna die". Everyone else will appreciate the attempt. (unless the healer is not up for it, always check with them before a run).

This might work for ARR; possibly HW. In SB and beyond, dungeons become so linear that the only thing that should be unfamiliar are the mechanics the boss uses. After a certain point, it is no longer really accepted that being new to a dungeon is a reason to run it at the flow rate of molasses. Mentioning that you're new might keep the chimps from wrecking your face, but they will still see you as a tank that is holding the group back. You also want to avoid the pessimism by saying things, "I'll try, but we'll probably die." Have some faith in your group, and yourself.

Finally, and I think this might be the most important thing... If you are asked to speed up or to adjust your playstyle, please avoid be rebellious just to spite the group or start any arguments. Just say "Can do" and move on. Everyone will leave the dungeon a happy camper this way and not spend the rest of the day POed.

This. The best way to diffuse a situation is to not let it light up in the first place. You might have to choke down some BS, but nothing slows down a dungeon run more than 2 or more players bickering at each other over arbitrary playstyles.

[Kaizencorr]

I think it's interesting how few people acknowledge that while yes, there are people that are uncomfortable with doing bigger pulls, that mentality shouldn't stick around forever. As a matter of fact, it's kind of appalling to take on the job of a tank and never get better than when you first started. If you are willingly going to dungeon at a snail's pace, instead of actively challenging yourself to get better, you are just bad.