"New game plus - quests will have no rewards..."

[TaleraRistain]

I've been lurking this thread for awhile now so I feel like now's a good time to ask...

Where were those "we want rewards with NG+" people whenever a thread popped up about requesting NG+? Been active on these forums, or more specifically, the general discussion subforum and while there have been--at least over the course of three years (and possibly even before I posted actively)--hundreds of posts requesting for NG+, can't say "rewards" were also at the top of that list.

Now they come out of the woodwork, feeling so jilted that a piece of content is not strapped with material gain. Where was all this disappointement of lack of material gain when Performance was added? And Gpose? pretty much anything in the game that wasn't strapped with material rewards?

Don't get me wrong: if you would like SE to add rewards to the NG+, please, feel free to do so. I will even personally add my support to it. But for the love of the Twelve, enough with the indignation, disappointment and faux outrage. You honestly cannot point the finger at this company for basically not seeing even a modicum of evidence that people wanted rewards stacked with NG+ en masse.

I know requesting things in sheer simplicity is an ancient relic of a lost age and now we have to weaponize our emotion cannons with outrage shells but give it a rest and lower it, for crying out loud.

I think part of it may be what they're calling it. New Game+ in any other game comes with re-leveling. It's possible people took it as a given that it would have exp rewards at least, since that's a core concept of NG+ in nearly any other game.

[Seraph522]

I think part of it may be what they're calling it. New Game+ in any other game comes with re-leveling. It's possible people took it as a given that it would have exp rewards at least, since that's a core concept of NG+ in nearly any other game.

I think that's a bit of a misconception, to be honest. By and large, NG+ means "replay the game but with certain bonuses" (at least in single player games; I'm not an MMO vet, so I'm not sure if this is common in this genre or if NG+ is even a thing in most other MMOs), which can vary wildly from game to game. Some games require you to level up all over again - Persona 5, for example, does this - but others carry over levels, like Persona 3, or automatically start you at a high level, like FFXII's updated versions (IZJS, Zodiac Age). Sometimes gear is carried over, sometimes it isn't. Generally, something is carried over, or some form of bonus is granted on the subsequent playthrough, but what that is by and large is up to the developers.

[Metalwrath]

I think that's a bit of a misconception, to be honest. By and large, NG+ means "replay the game but with certain bonuses" (at least in single player games; I'm not an MMO vet, so I'm not sure if this is common in this genre or if NG+ is even a thing in most other MMOs), which can vary wildly from game to game. Some games require you to level up all over again - Persona 5, for example, does this - but others carry over levels, like Persona 3, or automatically start you at a high level, like FFXII's updated versions (IZJS, Zodiac Age). Sometimes gear is carried over, sometimes it isn't. Generally, something is carried over, or some form of bonus is granted on the subsequent playthrough, but what that is by and large is up to the developers.

As far as what i recall the usual main selling point of new game plus isnt the leveling bonus but more the harder difficulty.It originally comes from harder difficulty settings in game for those who cleared on normal etc.

[dragonkyn20]

As far as what i recall the usual main selling point of new game plus isnt the leveling bonus but more the harder difficulty.It originally comes from harder difficulty settings in game for those who cleared on normal etc.

Harder difficulties wasn't the main selling point at first until the Souls series popularized it with enemy and boss stats scaling up by a certain percentage every time you beat the game.

When NG+ first became a thing, it was more to do with just replaying the game with new features.

[Seraph522]

Harder difficulties wasn't the main selling point at first until the Souls series popularized it with enemy and boss stats scaling up by a certain percentage every time you beat the game.

When NG+ first became a thing, it was more to do with just replaying the game with new features.

They definitely existed before the Souls games; I still remember Golden Sun: The Lost Age had two NG+ versions, one that carried over your levels and one that started you over with much tougher enemies. And FFXII: IZJS introduced both NG+, which started you over with all characters at level 90, and NG-, which restricts you from leveling up, creating a low-level challenge. Additionally, harder difficulty levels have often been locked behind an initial playthrough in some games; Kingdom Hearts II: Final Mix did this with Critical mode, and Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn similarly locked Hard mode (Maniac Mode in Japanese; that game had some weird localization problems in regards to its difficulty settings) behind completing the game once.

That being said, it was almost always an option rather than the primary selling point of NG+, which is definitely the case with the Souls games, so that popularized that trend to some degree.

Edit: I can't confirm whether or not KHII: Final Mix locked Critical mode behind game completion, so take that example with a grain of salt.

[dragonkyn20]

They definitely existed before the Souls games; I still remember Golden Sun: The Lost Age had two NG+ versions, one that carried over your levels and one that started you over with much tougher enemies. And FFXII: IZJS introduced both NG+, which started you over with all characters at level 90, and NG-, which restricts you from leveling up, creating a low-level challenge. Additionally, harder difficulty levels have often been locked behind an initial playthrough in some games; Kingdom Hearts II: Final Mix did this with Critical mode, and Fire Emblem: Radiant Dawn similarly locked Hard mode (Maniac Mode in Japanese; that game had some weird localization problems in regards to its difficulty settings) behind completing the game once.

That being said, it was almost always an option rather than the primary selling point of NG+, which is definitely the case with the Souls games, so that popularized that trend to some degree.

I never said Souls was the first series to have it, I said it was the series to popularize harder difficulties. Chrono Trigger was the first game to popularize the term "New Game +" and its version didn't include difficulty scaling at all unless you count fighting the final boss much earlier on than you're supposed to a higher difficulty.

[Seraph522]

I never said Souls was the first series to have it, I said it was the series to popularize harder difficulties. Chrono Trigger was the first game to popularize the term "New Game +" and its version didn't include difficulty scaling at all unless you count fighting the final boss much earlier on than you're supposed to a higher difficulty.

Yeah, I think I read "not the main selling point" as "not really important," which wasn't what you said (my apologies for that).

[Metalwrath]

I never said Souls was the first series to have it, I said it was the series to popularize harder difficulties. Chrono Trigger was the first game to popularize the term "New Game +" and its version didn't include difficulty scaling at all unless you count fighting the final boss much earlier on than you're supposed to a higher difficulty.

I guess you never heard of the resident evil series then.This was back on ps1 so it might be before your time but it was games like that that popularised it.

[dragonkyn20]

I think that's a bit of a misconception, to be honest. By and large, NG+ means "replay the game but with certain bonuses" (at least in single player games; I'm not an MMO vet, so I'm not sure if this is common in this genre or if NG+ is even a thing in most other MMOs), which can vary wildly from game to game. Some games require you to level up all over again - Persona 5, for example, does this - but others carry over levels, like Persona 3, or automatically start you at a high level, like FFXII's updated versions (IZJS, Zodiac Age). Sometimes gear is carried over, sometimes it isn't. Generally, something is carried over, or some form of bonus is granted on the subsequent playthrough, but what that is by and large is up to the developers.

You got it right. NG+'s implementation differs depending on the game in various ways like you listed. Usually the big things are gear and/or levels carrying over, additional difficulties, and new post-game content to experience.