Why is the majority of the content in the game not ilv capped???

[Laphael]

Some players think challenging content is fun, others don´t.
If you want a challenge, do the fights at min ilvl, or do the current savage raids and ultimates.

[van_arn]

The issue isn't that the fights are easy, that's just incidentally true.

The issue is the dungeons are *too* easy for too long to be engaging to a new player. The floor needs to be somewhere between where it is now and min ilvl.

The game doesn't even start to require a modicum of attention until 63 or so (with a one-dungeon one-boss detour at the Vault). Emphasis on new player, that's a hell of a long time to go just being a 123 hero and watching cutscenes.

The path to 70 is so simple people get there without even clearing Heavensward or knowing the basics of their class. This is a design failure.

Note I'm not saying dungeons need to be hard. They simply need to require a tad more attention than they do now, but not as much as min ilvl, otherwise they aren't able to do their job-- teach players how to work in a party.

[Rongway]

I don't disagree that things are too easy in general. Here is the primary point where I disagree:

The path to 70 is so simple people get there without even clearing Heavensward or knowing the basics of their class. This is a design failure.

Note I'm not saying dungeons need to be hard. They simply need to require a tad more attention than they do now, but not as much as min ilvl, otherwise they aren't able to do their job-- teach players how to work in a party.

The people who don't know how to play their jobs by 70 are not in that situation because things are too easy. People who want to play their jobs well will learn to play their jobs well regardless of the difficulty of the content. If they get to cap and still don't know how to play their jobs, demanding more out of them in dungeons won't make them better.


That there are people who fall into that category is unfortunate, but realistic. Should we make things harder and drive them off? Some will say yes, for the sake of increasing the average skill level by reducing the population of lower performing players.

But some will say the game should be enjoyed by as many people as possible, and these people will argue that there do exist ways for the people who want more challenge to experience the level of challenge they want. Keeping things at the current difficulty allows more people to enjoy the game, while the people who want more challenge can still experience it via the choice of which content to participate in or special paramters under which to participate.


(Note: I'm absolutely not saying that the difficulty of "difficult" content should be reduced so that anyone can beat it; but casual content is casual content. It's okay to let the people who need or want easier content play the casual stuff.)

[ZellosWilder]

And now imagine you farmed gear for an eternity because you didn't take a break and you que up for something and end up in a dungeon where your complete gear is useless and the dungeon feels like chewing gum because of it. Would you que up for it again if you don't really need tomes or something else? I don't think so.

It would be way more important to implement a min ilvl for every single dungeon.

First thing I would like to point out is that no gear in this game is hard to obtain grinding barely exists especially compared to other MMOs... FF14 makes it seem like child's play so when you say that obtaining gear takes an "eternity" I'm not sure what you mean by this >_> the only thing that required alot of grinding were the atma weps etc when they first came out but it's just for glamour now. Gear is so irrelevant in this game as they consistently add a new best gear set every update you holding on gear a few months at best.

Also grinding for gear honestly doesn't really matter in this game unless you are doing the hardest level stuff going back to lower tier stuff with a ilv cap doesn't really affect anything but clearing something a few mins faster hurting the player's ego because they can't kill them as fast as possible to get their boring ass tomestones to obtain more useless gear that is about to become irrelevant a couple of months later.

You're literally just clearing content a few mins faster to ruin the mechanics of the actual fight this is just a complete failure of design choice from the devs and it gets worse the further back you go with content. How is it hard to understand that the design of said dungeon/fight wasn't designed for being 100+ ilv over the required avg ilv of entering.


While I agree with you that min ilv is also required, my post is talking about there being a ilv cap but it just goes to show how poorly thought out the dev team has been with ilv requirements on both ends.

[Caitlinzulu]

If you dont want dungeons to be a snooze, just dont run them unsynced!
There is no dungeon in the game where you can be 100 or more ilvl's over the min one without unsyncing it.
What could be done is sync most lower level dungeons just a bit lower then they currently are.

You say grinding hardly exists in this game?? then you propebly never done any relic when they were current. the grinding was real. Case in point was the arr atma grinding where people would take months to get the necesary crystals. or later on when we needed a semi rare dungeon drop from the final boss, leading to some people having to run the dungeon like 50-100 times.
and that for 12 drops in total

[Wiccan026]

I see gross over generalization in the OP.

Two simple ones are every mechanic can be ignored due to ilevel sync not being "fine tuned". Not going to waste time debating dungeons, but the heavensward 24 mans and the stormblood 24 mans one needs to pay attention to mechanics (and you can tell based off of where things are now that even when shadowbringers is a thing people will still have to pay attention to mechanics). The crystal tower series its "harder" to fine tune (both labyrinth and sycalla tower were easiesh to complete upon release and fine tuning those down to the ilevel needed to get in would be the only way to try to accomplish anything... and the majority would never want that). Id agree void ark is a snooze in heavensward but that was a snooze upon release. All better gear is going to allow is more leeway if people do dumb stuff (for the record I was with a party recently that wiped on the skull dragon in labyrinth, with no bonus so that happened).

The second one is that the newer players are being hurt... trust me newer players would be far more hurt if they try to mess with ilevel... because the majority of older players will stop queuing for things unless they up the rewards (which could hurt more than help due to balancing issues) I mean just look at the main scenario to see that.

[ZellosWilder]

You say grinding hardly exists in this game?? then you propebly never done any relic when they were current. the grinding was real. Case in point was the arr atma grinding where people would take months to get the necesary crystals. or later on when we needed a semi rare dungeon drop from the final boss, leading to some people having to run the dungeon like 50-100 times.
and that for 12 drops in total

/facepalm

you didn't even read what I wrote.... I literally just said except for those atma weps....

[ZellosWilder]

If you dont want dungeons to be a snooze, just dont run them unsynced!

Yes I don't run dungeons unsync but i'm talking about all content here, even if I dont want to use unsync it still allows others to do so, making there less players looking for that content sync'd via party finder or less players queuing for it in duty finder for the full group. If there was no level unsync more players would actually want to do that content at the intended lv cap / ilv cap.

Unsync works against players wanting to do content how it was suppose to be, as there is little to no reason to even have unsync'd in a MMO game because at the end of the day it's a MMO not a single player game.

There is no dungeon in the game where you can be 100 or more ilvl's over the min one without unsyncing it.

The max gear in the game is currently ilv 400 ish? that's 90 ilv over the first few lv70 SB dungeons which are 310 avg ilv to enter thats close enough to 100 ilv over the required. Sorry but no dungeon should have that much of an increase as they weren't designed that way.

[Wiccan026]

The max gear in the game is currently ilv 400 ish? that's 90 ilv over the first few lv70 SB dungeons which are 310 avg ilv to enter thats close enough to 100 ilv over the required. Sorry but no dungeon should have that much of an increase as they weren't designed that way.

LOL have you played recently thats not how those work

[ZellosWilder]

I see gross over generalization in the OP.

I posted my own opinion nothing more nothing less. I do not generalise anything I'm just giving my own feedback of the current state of the game and found it way too easy because nothing is ilv capped.

Two simple ones are every mechanic can be ignored due to ilevel sync not being "fine tuned". Not going to waste time debating dungeons, but the heavensward 24 mans and the stormblood 24 mans one needs to pay attention to mechanics (and you can tell based off of where things are now that even when shadowbringers is a thing people will still have to pay attention to mechanics). The crystal tower series its "harder" to fine tune (both labyrinth and sycalla tower were easiesh to complete upon release and fine tuning those down to the ilevel needed to get in would be the only way to try to accomplish anything... and the majority would never want that). Id agree void ark is a snooze in heavensward but that was a snooze upon release. All better gear is going to allow is more leeway if people do dumb stuff (for the record I was with a party recently that wiped on the skull dragon in labyrinth, with no bonus so that happened).

The second one is that the newer players are being hurt... trust me newer players would be far more hurt if they try to mess with ilevel... because the majority of older players will stop queuing for things unless they up the rewards (which could hurt more than help due to balancing issues) I mean just look at the main scenario to see that.

Most mechanics that are still hard are the one hit KO ones tho like the first fight in the HW raid "Dun Scaith" where you can get blown off. Those are usually the only times where you see players wipe in those raids, other than that players aint gonna wipe unless most are new players.

As for the SB raids those are still current most players wont of reached the max ilv for it that is why it's still challenging to a degree even though you can be 95 ilvs over the required entry.

I disagree with players won't queue for roulettes if they don't increase their rewards, I queued for Main story roulette and got in pretty fast as a DPS the rewards felt justified. You could make any roulette with tomestones as the reward and you will get players queuing up for it.

They could even add a hardcore roulette for coil, extreme and other savage fights and players would still queue up for it, less will do those over other roulettes but the point is some players would still do them regardless. If those existed then I would agree with you that the rewards for only those roulettes might have to be increased in helping.