Performance-based roll system

[Dzian]

Any ideas on how we can make rolling on loot somewhat performance-based? I'm mainly talking about the non-savage duty funder type stuff like dungeons, normal raids, trials, etc. It would be nice to reward people who perform with a +20 to whatever they would've rolled so that there's an incentive to do your best instead of letting people carry you. It's kind of annoying to see players die to easy mechanics 4 times, contribute nothing, and then win the loot with a 95 roll while the people who actually did the work lose out.

It would never work and would be impossible to implement.

Can you imagine if only 2 players stacked for a shared damage mechanic and both died as a result. That death would then impact there performance especially if for some reason they weren't raised super fast.. and have a massive chunk of downtime as a result. Blocking them out of loot rolls while everyone else who failed to do that mechanic gets to roll on loot at the end...

Its be a nightmare.

[CaptainLagbeard]

But if everyone is playing it multiple times to get better roll chances, then you're likely to encounter other players who have also run it multiple times and have also got the roll bonus, which results in you not actually having any advantage against them.

If you haven't run it multiple times this week already, and you're paired with people who have, which would be likely, then you'll have less chance to roll, and depending on how great a bonus it is or how much it stacks, you could be guaranteed to not be successful on your first or first few runs.
You will need to run it multiple times to 'build up' your roll bonus, before you even have a shot at winning your loot, before taking into account that you need that loot to drop in the first place.

Basically you will need to grind it out, in order to get back to square one. So this will only enforce more grinding.

I do suppose it would very much leave people who don't start doing the raids on tuesday at a disadvantage, it is pretty much impossible to create a perfect system for the loot, the RNG will leave people running the raids way more than they should but other non-RNG systems either wouldn't work with the duty finder or could backfire.

The only viable solution I can see, is that if the party consists of enough people who have run it multiple times, then the raid actually drops more loot.

More loot would also very much help with getting weekly runs on the raids, at least the 8 man ones.

[DrWho2010]

mostly the system is the way it is because it's not going anywhere and most stuff can be run ad nauseum. it's all a matter of your own personal patience.

[Shurrikhan]

The only viable solution I can see, is that if the party consists of enough people who have run it multiple times, then the raid actually drops more loot.

This. More or less. At minimum, it will take half as many runs as there are players -- total playerbase, not just one party -- who wish to get an item, not counting remainders unable to form a party. At most, it will take the same number of runs as there are players -- again, total playerbase.

You increase the loot, you decrease the required ratio of runs.

Now, you can do this in a couple ways. It can be a literal increase (chance at a bonus chest), or you can include some sort of token currency per run such that one is able to generate further loot (i.e. cash the tokens for a reward of their choosing).

[Seraphor]

Something occured to me while running Alliance raids today.
Have the Alliance that deals the most cumulative damage rewarded with an additional treasure coffer, or they get an upgraded coffer with three peices of loot instead of two.

The DPS of a party is reliant on everyone doing well, you cant screw other people over, lack of healing, poor emnity control, or deaths, will reduce overall damage output, so everyone just has to play their jobs to their best.
It'd be a flat out three-way competition, a team endurance race of sorts.

There's still an element of luck, you can be paired up with poor performers, but it would give more incentive for everyone to try their best, without being so important that it leads to toxicity against poor performers, its only one or two extra peices of loot after all.

[Emstidor]

Something occured to me while running Alliance raids today.
Have the Alliance that deals the most cumulative damage rewarded with an additional treasure coffer, or they get an upgraded coffer with three peices of loot instead of two.

The DPS of a party is reliant on everyone doing well, you cant screw other people over, lack of healing, poor emnity control, or deaths, will reduce overall damage output, so everyone just has to play their jobs to their best.
It'd be a flat out three-way competition, a team endurance race of sorts.

There's still an element of luck, you can be paired up with poor performers, but it would give more incentive for everyone to try their best, without being so important that it leads to toxicity against poor performers, its only one or two extra peices of loot after all.

Like a lot of the ideas posted upthread, the intent is good but I fear that the reality would result in "That dps on our team who barely meets the ilvl requirement and is running this raid for gear upgrades is holding us back, let's kick him and roll the dice on getting a geared replacement."

[Vahlnir]

Loot rolling is fine as is so long as they don't try what they did with Ridorana Lighthouse by making loot rolls greed only. This was quickly fixed (and the backlash was severe) so I'm assuming it's probably not something they'll risk again. It has worked fine since 2.0 launch. No sense in changing it or even making your suggestion an option. Something tells me a lost loot roll brought this on. We've all had that happen. It sucks, but that's just the way it goes. Random will be random.

[Kleeya]

Something occured to me while running Alliance raids today.
Have the Alliance that deals the most cumulative damage rewarded with an additional treasure coffer, or they get an upgraded coffer with three peices of loot instead of two.

The DPS of a party is reliant on everyone doing well, you cant screw other people over, lack of healing, poor emnity control, or deaths, will reduce overall damage output, so everyone just has to play their jobs to their best.
It'd be a flat out three-way competition, a team endurance race of sorts.

There's still an element of luck, you can be paired up with poor performers, but it would give more incentive for everyone to try their best, without being so important that it leads to toxicity against poor performers, its only one or two extra peices of loot after all.

As a red mage main, it would only incite me to never rez players of the other alliances, even at the risk of screwing up the whole raid. Don't rage at me if i continue to dps the boss over your corpse : you want competition ? You have it XD

There is already enough dps epeen contests in savage, please dont bring me that in casual content meant to be played in cooperation with other people, and not against them.

[Ilan]

As a red mage main, it would only incite me to never rez players of the other alliances, even at the risk of screwing up the whole raid. Don't rage at me if i continue to dps the boss over your corpse : you want competition ? You have it XD

There is already enough dps epeen contests in savage, please dont bring me that in casual content meant to be played in cooperation with other people, and not against them.

Sorry but i have to be the one that says it. The biggest part of the RDM's you'll get in DF won't raise anyway because they don't care or because they didn't read the tooltips.

[Seraphor]

Like a lot of the ideas posted upthread, the intent is good but I fear that the reality would result in "That dps on our team who barely meets the ilvl requirement and is running this raid for gear upgrades is holding us back, let's kick him and roll the dice on getting a geared replacement."

Kicking and waiting for a replacement would hurt the party's dps more, they'd be better off sucking it up and running it again.