Survey: Community Opinions Regarding Parsing/Parsers in Final Fantasy XIV

[Metalwrath]

I disagree.Because of doing content unsynced a lot of people actually dont know recycled mechanics.I see it the whole time.
Nidhogg ex is a prime example of people not bothering to learn mechanics.There is actually a much lower success rate of players clearing this at lvl 70 than there was at lvl 60.
Simple reason is people are being brought up on the idea that its more important to dps hard to skip mechanics than to learn mechanics.
The end result being that people run around like headlless chickens on fireball phase and kill each other and then blame low dps.

[Vstarstruck]

If a parser were implemented would it suddenly negate the fact that harassment is against the ToS and is a bannable offense? I don't think so.
A parser being part of the game does not entitle any player to disrespect any other player. Harrassing some about their dps/glam/irl things will still be against the rules.

I addressed that:

ON FFXIV the only reason you do not see it a lot is because most people know they will be easily hit by a GM when it is reported, and yet PEOPLE STILL DO IT, rarely, but the fact remains it still happens when it is a ToS violation, what do you think will happen if they allow public parers? GM calls be flooded with complaints. That is another reason they do not want to open Pandora's box, it is quite clear they do not get a lot of budget and a small GM team, they wouldn't be able to handle the volume of calls it would bring, on top of large skill gaps, you are just playing with fire, releasing a public parser in this game's state.

I bet you that is the main reason they do not want to add an official praser.

[Sarynn]

I love parsers for myself and my group. Main reason is because you can see where the group is lagging. Not from a blame standpoint, but just from a data standpoint. No deaths except for a team-wide enrage wipe? Let's look at the DPS numbers and see what's going on. Perhaps someone isn't using an optimal rotation or doesn't know any better. A teaching moment! Tons of deaths but DPS was decent? You can see total amount of deaths, and per person. This is usually not understanding mechanics well. Another teaching moment.

You get the idea. Parsers help you with this, and if you're a good human, allows you to try to help others with that data instead of scrutinize them.

[Avatre]

Frankly, I think this is what needs to happen at a community level. We need to understand that there are different player groups, and not everyone is going to fit into each player group, and that's absolutely fine! Build up a community of like-minded individuals. Ir's OK to not get on with everyone! Let's not let the select few ruin it for everyone else.

Oh, I completely agree. I'm just saying that there will be people who view it as harassment, and will likely come to the forums screaming bloody murder. The best way, at least that I find, to deal with situations I don't agree with(aside from physical harm to others/stuff that I can actually make a difference in by speaking up/acting against) is to move along past it and not let it get to me/ignore that it's actually there.

[HyoMinPark]

raiders really cheese a lot of things and think its skill when its not. If the boss ever decided to reflect debuffs, you'd all have no idea what to do.

Riyah, I have asked you before why you care so much about parser debates, especially when they relate to content that you do not even take part in, and have never received an answer. You’ve made your stance on how you feel about raiders and parsers well-known through a lot of unnecessarily hostile and ignorant posts. We get it; you don’t like raiders and you don’t like parsers. And that’s fine. But there’s no need for overexaggeration, nor your hostility.



This thread is supposed to be about survey feedback, opinion clarifications and explanations, and for civilized discussion. Coming in here and calling people (key word here is people) pigheaded just because you disagree with them is not civilized. This thread was more or less civilized debating until the last couple of pages, which was something I was glad to see, since so many debates surrounding parsers and raiders tend to turn sour quickly. I’m asking everyone here now to just return to the polite debates that the majority of the thread has been. You can’t get anywhere with name-calling and hostility, and they do nothing for your arguments.

[Oscura]

the encounters have been similar for the most part

Not even going to waste my time explaining why someone who doesn't raid shouldn't even bother posting their meaningless opinion on how similar or different encounters have been.

The big difference is that its easier overall, and people only adapted because they nerfed the heck out of HW to bring it down to a much more palatable level.Whenever they make it hard again, grats less than 1% of the playerbase clears, i.e Super Savage.

They never "nerfed" HW. If you're referring to Gordias, they went on record to say they that they didn't even test the content properly. It had nothing to do with difficulty. It was developer incompetence.

I don't think they'd adapt as easy as people think, and for people who talk so much about unskilled players, they forget how much raiding was nerfed to keep people even doing it,

That's your opinion, and the only raiding content "nerfed," aside from post-relevance or during echo is the difficulty comparison between Omega and Alexander, specifically creator. They only lowered the difficulty because people they wanted a lower bottom line. Raiders, who we are talking about, not casuals, did the content just fine and had little complaints. In fact some people considered creator and omega too easy.

and how easy SE can just break 90% of raiders through difficulty in content.

Flat out untrue. Generally anyone who gets cold feet and quits was never a serious raider in the first place. Most midcore groups have never quit content just because it was difficult.

And pigheaded is the constant raider obsession with getting parsers into the game; they need to make raids much harder if they are going to worry so much about others playing and not themselves.

"I don't like the way certain people talk so I'm validated in making rude comments," Ok. Two wrongs don't make a right. Just because you think that way doesn't mean you can blanket statement raiders as people who are incapable of playing the game if their precious meta is broken, or that they're too stupid to function in conditions where things aren't ideal for them. Despite the fact that raiders have constantly asked for that, which is why ultimate exists. There are plenty of groups who are still attempting to clear ultimate, even if many haven't.

Also it's not just raiders who want parsers, but feel free to constantly ignore those people who have already stated they don't raid and still want one.

Do you really just hate people having a different definition of fun than you? It feels like like everything you post is so personally driven.

Coming in here and calling people (key word here is people) pigheaded just because you disagree with them is not civilized.

Was this addressing me? I actually can't tell since you mention the keyword, and I was specifically addressing the words being used and less Riyah as a person.

[Vstarstruck]

Riyah, I have asked you before why you care so much about parser debates, especially when they relate to content that you do not even take part in, and have never received an answer. You’ve made your stance on how you feel about raiders and parsers well-known through a lot of unnecessarily hostile and ignorantposts. We get it; you don’t like raiders and you don’t like parsers. And that’s fine. But there’s no need for overexaggeration, nor your hostility.



This thread is supposed to be about survey feedback, opinion clarifications and explanations, and for civilized discussion. Coming in here and calling people (key word here is people) pigheaded just because you disagree with them is not civilized. This thread was more or less civilized debating until the last couple of pages, which was something I was glad to see, since so many debates surrounding parsers and raiders tend to turn sour quickly. I’m asking everyone here now to just return to the polite debates that the majority of the thread has been. You can’t get anywhere with name-calling and hostility, and they do nothing for your arguments.

feel free tell me if i go outside the scope of the thread you had envisioned. In the end of the day I wish FFXIV's development team would give us SOMETHING to fight the huge skill gap.

[SenorPatty]

I am not a 5 year old, you can talk about one's dps without a parser and without harassment. I am always been referring to harassment based on parsers, as in, something wouldn't happen if the person was not using them, like kick abuse, repeatably being vulgar, telling people to uninstall and die, making people feel bad because some healer or tank has more DPS then someone on DPS job, etc... You did not give support to anything other then proving my point, like the other poster tried to explain, it is from your limited range of people that you deal with, to make it seem parser harassment is at a minimum on wow. ON FFXIV the only reason you do not see it a lot is because most people know they will be easily hit by a GM when it is reported, and yet PEOPLE STILL DO IT, rarely, but the fact remains it still happens when it is a ToS violation, what do you think will happen if they allow public parers? GM calls be flooded with complaints. That is another reason they do not want to open Pandora's box, it is quite clear they do not get a lot of budget and a small GM team, they wouldn't be able to handle the volume of calls it would bring, on top of large skill gaps, you are just playing with fire, releasing a public parser in this game's state.

I need to preface two things here:

First, I do agree that parser harassment exist. As to how much obviously depends on someone's POV.

Second: Just by going from "The tales of DF", its clear that people have different views on what is harassment and I'll explain below.

With that out of the way...

When it comes to the first and second bolded part, I'm left confused. You see, for awhile now, one of the more most common points that anti-parsers make is that there will be more harassment than before. Plus you mention they wouldn't happen without a parser. So I read the bolded parts and then I think this:


kick abuse: Happens already except you have to ask yourself which is worse: the person kicking because they feel like you're the one doing bad dps or they kick because they actually have a tool that literally proves you're doing bad dps? And this is just the worst of scenarios, in which the kick abuser's some idiot who only looks at numbers, for better lack of word. What if the kick abuser, in a better scenario, actually understands how to use and operate a parser and has no other recourse but to kick you, as civilly as possible? Is that still a form of harassment?

repeatably being vulgar:Here's an hypothetical here: Today, Ben and Jane-with the "don't ask, don't tell" parser policy-decide to join a savage run seperately. Ben's a total dick all day and all night. Jane's a good natured played. They both parse silently. Someone keeps wiping the raid in both of their runs. Ben being Ben harasses the unskilled player without the mention of a parser. He gets reported anyways and gets a strike. Jane on the other hand, simply mentions that it doesn't work out and states matters as-of-factly. She hopes the unskilled player gets better and disbands.

With your statement, you're making sounds as if tomorrow, if the parse policy would get lifted, Ben gets a full license to be an ass without sanction and since you say "there will be more", Jane will be a full on bitch with the parser. Except we already know harassment in any shape or form, gets punished.

And this is where my second preface point comes in: We know there's people who view being called out as harassment. Is the "more harassment" you speak of include Jane's civil treatment of the unskilled player? Because if it is, then yes, ironically you'd be right: there will be "more harassment".


telling people to uninstall and die: already happens and this doesn't even occur just in raiding. PvP has been at times rife with this. Again, still not okay regardless of circumstances and since this is a death threat, there's a great likely hood that the person who says it either gets banned outright or even perma-banned. Its not the use of a parser under our current policy that's holding people back and even if it did exist, that still would not be what would push them to say it or not say it. TL;DR :its not a parser that's going to influence someone to tell someone else to die.

making people feel bad because some healer or tank has more DPS then someone on DPS job: And this here, I feel is the crux of what all this anti-parse point is about. Again, using the small sample from "The tales of DF" thread, people have proven to be very aggressive against any form of callout. They can't handle accountability, they can't handle being told "you're dps is not great" even in the most neutral of sayings. I've seen the screenshots. I've seen those people calling others toxic for it and that for them, its harassment.

So I have to ask again: when someone says "there will be more harassment", do they mean the above? Do they mean that, since they view being called out (even civilly) as harassment, there will be more of that?

Its something anti-parsers who use that as their main argument need to think about. Because as long as you view accountability as harassment, then yes: there would be more of it.

As for the rest of of your post: If that's how you envision's the FF14 staff, then naturally you'd come to the conclusion that they'd get swamped with reports.

[Tridus]

if the boss randomly decided to increase enmity on one party member, it would break your shirk combo. If they nerfed nin shadewalker, youd be screwed. If DRG only buffed spear damage instead of all piercing damage, and all buffs were solely for each jobs weapon type, you'd lose so much advantage that you'd be scrambling for a new meta. If healing potency dropped, you'd have no choice but to stay in tank stance and use jobs with mitigation in tank stance. most of you guys vastly overrate your skill and underrate how much the mob design more or less give certain party metas free reign.

You seem to be under the delusion that the current meta didn't spring out of how the game works now, and that it hasn't changed over time as classes and mechanics were altered.

If SE nerfed Shadewalker and buffed incoming damage to the point that tank stance was necessary, raiders would adapt. They always have before.

[Oscura]

You seem to be under the delusion that the current meta didn't spring out of how the game works now, and that it hasn't changed over time as classes and mechanics were altered.

If SE nerfed Shadewalker and buffed incoming damage to the point that tank stance was necessary, raiders would adapt. They always have before.

Exactly.

It's like people forget that at one point in this game's lifespan that Shadewalker didn't even exist.