Survey: Community Opinions Regarding Parsing/Parsers in Final Fantasy XIV

[HyoMinPark]

Was this addressing me? I actually can't tell since you mention the keyword, and I was specifically addressing the words being used and less Riyah as a person.

It was more so with regards to Riyah. I know that you were addressing the statement as pigheaded; to me, it seemed that she was addressing raiders as a whole as pigheaded, hence why I included the word “people” in an attempt to clarify. It’s one thing to refer to comments as pigheaded or stupid, but another to actually call someone pigheaded or stupid. Of course, my interpretation of her comment could also be tainted by previous posts made by her, which are generally negative in terms of how she views raiders, raiding in general, and parsing. I apologize if that was unclear.

More so, I’m just trying to put a stop to any unneeded hostility, since that wasn’t the purpose of the thread, and I much prefer seeing civilized arguments between posters compared to arguments where people do nothing but name-call and make needless/baseless exaggerations. People are always entitled to their opinions, but opinions and thoughts can always be conveyed without the layers upon layers of hostility I sometimes see on here.

feel free tell me if i go outside the scope of the thread you had envisioned. In the end of the day I wish FFXIV's development team would give us SOMETHING to fight the huge skill gap.

So far, none of your posts have stood out to me as incredibly hostile, so I think you are fine. :3 I don’t mind if people want to politely debate pros and cons of parsers amidst their feedback; I just take issue with people that come into threads trying to push personal agendas, blatantly start crap by baiting people, or have nothing to actually add to or promote discussion.

[Sebazy]

I apologise in advance Hyomin =/

Still proving my point. It limits your experience to the full player base. You do not know how widespread parser harassment is, why are you even posting here on this issue? parser harassment is common, PERIOD.

Then stop passing your opinion as fact?

Don't you see the irony in what you are saying?

Claiming that parser harassment is common is a HUGE claim, I'd put that in 72pt bold if I could. Yet you have nothing to back it up, nor does your profile indicate any real experience within this game. Do your viewpoint a favour and show us why we should believe your opinion over Kaldea's. If parser harassment really was common, these forums would be awash with screen caps of it. Now I dunno if you've noticed, but uh, that's not the case, certainly not as far as I can see.

The most concrete example you see on these boards is the is the oft mentioned JP niconico stream, yet the parser abuse was only part of the picture and frankly, even if they hadn't have had that tool at their disposal they would have moved straight onto the sexist drivel and straight up trolling etc. They went in to that situation with the intent to hurl abuse at her long before any parser numbers started flashing up on screen. It just happened to be the first of many 'stones' that they threw.

They even started standardizing and reusing earlier mechanics from past endgame, in order to enable players to eyeball and predict them. The big difference is that its easier overall, and people only adapted because they nerfed the heck out of HW to bring it down to a much more palatable level.

You realise that Savage has been watered down over time to make it appeal more to the casual scene right? Show me someone who claims to be a 'raider' yet whined about the difficulty of T9 or A8S and I'll show you a wannabe that's too big for their boots.

Whenever they make it hard again, grats less than 1% of the playerbase clears, i.e Super Savage.

Super Savage is a double whammy of high difficulty and an exceptionally long sequence of mechanics to learn and remember. Many groups simply aren't willing to put in the time needed as a whole unfortunately. Consider trying your hand at it and perhaps you'll appreciate why 1% of the player base has cleared it, I've pugged to Bahamut and since I apparently can't react to things, you should have no problems right?

I don't think they'd adapt as easy as people think, and for people who talk so much about unskilled players, they forget how much raiding was nerfed to keep people even doing it, and how easy SE can just break 90% of raiders through difficulty in content.

A opinion clearly built on an irrational hatred for 'raiders' and everything that entails.

How dare you brand us as being toxic when this is how you behave.

Whoa, this thread heated up. Let's be respectful, folks.

Demonizing the individuals on the other side of the topic just makes you look foolish.

^ This

Even if you don't agree with something, it's always better to be rational, realistic and well grounded in how you go about debating against something. I'm old, grouchy and highly opinionated but I also know that I'll do a much better job of putting my point across if I base it around clear and concise facts rather than just stating 'h8 u all' and leaving it at that

[Oscura]

It was more so with regards to Riyah. I know that you were addressing the statement as pigheaded; to me, it seemed that she was addressing raiders as a whole as pigheaded, hence why I included the word “people” in an attempt to clarify. It’s one thing to refer to comments as pigheaded or stupid, but another to actually call someone pigheaded or stupid. Of course, my interpretation of her comment could also be tainted by previous posts made by her, which are generally negative in terms of how she views raiders, raiding in general, and parsing. I apologize if that was unclear.

It's fine, I just wanted to make sure that I wasn't misinterpreted. I'm generally harsher than the average person but I never try to get personal with someone I'm either arguing or debating with and I didn't want you to feel that I was muddying up your goal for the thread with my posts. It wasn't and isn't my intent, and sorry if my replies pushed it further despite said lack of intent.

[Kacho_Nacho]

Whoa, this thread heated up. Let's be respectful, folks.

Demonizing the individuals on the other side of the topic just makes you look foolish.

*Now that's odd. I posted this several hours ago. I have no idea why it didn't pop up until 8:27 pm. Another weird thing, Sebazy quoted my post but there is no duplicate and the time stamp for my post is over an hour later.

Has there been a forum issue, moderators?

[Vstarstruck]

I apologise in advance Hyomin =/




Don't you see the irony in what you are saying?

Claiming that parser harassment is common is a HUGE claim, I'd put that in 72pt bold if I could. Yet you have nothing to back it up, nor does your profile indicate any real experience within this game. Do your viewpoint a favour and show us why we should believe your opinion over Kaldea's. If parser harassment really was common, these forums would be awash with screen caps of it. Now I dunno if you've noticed, but uh, that's not the case, certainly not as far as I can see.

The most concrete example you see on these boards is the is the oft mentioned JP niconico stream, yet the parser abuse was only part of the picture and frankly, even if they hadn't have had that tool at their disposal they would have moved straight onto the sexist drivel and straight up trolling etc. They went in to that situation with the intent to hurl abuse at her long before any parser numbers started flashing up on screen. It just happened to be the first 'stone' that they threw.

Wow it is common then again any kind of harassment is common in wow, as well as going to further drastic measures then this game. My only point is for this game specifically, if parser harassment exists when it is a ToS violation, it will only increase if a public one is made. Parser harassment is a lot rarer in this game and ofc it is likely SE's stance on it. As I said though, it is only bound to get worse with a public one, and I think they are scared of GM call volume on that and if they can handle it.

[Sebazy]

Wow it is common then again any kind of harassment is common in wow, as well as going to further drastic measures then this game. My only point is for this game specifically, if parser harassment exists when it is a ToS violation, it will only increase if a public one is made

But what is this assumption based on?

Remember that WoW is built on very different foundations to FFXIV. WoW is designed to be competitive and generate angst within it's player base. The faction v faction element runs through it's very core and certainly extended into PvE content back when I used to play (Launch to BC).

One example of this would be to think about what is considered acceptable within the community within both games. A good starting point would simply be WoW's /spit emote, this sort of behaviour is typically seen as 'acceptable' (Personally I think it's an absolutely disgusting thing to have in a game), something that is reinforced by virtue of that emote being there. On the flipside of the coin, imagine if I went over to Ensemble or some other rival progression FC's house and started throwing out '/em spits on %t' at various people. I'd likely burn every bridge with that FC, earn a firm warning from a GM and get kicked and disowned from my own FC to boot. And rightfully so too, that would be utterly disgraceful behaviour, that's a view I suspect everyone would share, regardless of if they are a raider or casual.

WoW and FFXIV's communities are very very different, this is why I don't think that your assumptions are particularly fair or accurate.

As I said though, it is only bound to get worse with a public one, and I think they are scared of GM call volume on that and if they can handle it.

Legitimate question here, have you actually reported a case of harassment that required a GM's response? Credit where credit is due, SE's GM team are exceptionally hot on this sort of stuff. From what experiences I have (Such as a healer that was trolling in Rabanastre a few months back) they've always been on the ball.

[Moonlite]

Legitimate question here, have you actually reported a case of harassment that required a GM's response? Credit where credit is due, SE's GM team are exceptionally hot on this sort of stuff. From what experiences I have (Such as a healer that was trolling in Rabanastre a few months back) they've always been on the ball.

Honest question. You feel the GMs actually work better in 14 then in WoW. In WoW action was generally swift and sure. Half the GMs in 14 can't even work out some of the rules. Sometimes the dev teams takes weeks to answer if stuff is an actual violation. Also the one time in WoW I had a problem, I had a follow up tell that they wouldn't be bothering anyone for a few days and if they bothered again ask for GM "damn can't remember his name". The couple interactions have seemed to be swift, but did not leave me feeling confident that anything happened. Others I know nothing has happened, for whatever reason SE reacts to cheating.

My biggest issue is lack of community policing that cross server systems create. In 11 and Pre late lich king WoW the community punished those who had issues. This person loots bad, this person boots for friends, this person leaves mid pulls, this person is offensive, and so on. It was always a quick shout any time they tried to create groups. Modern MMO just doesn't have this anymore. Can't even post actual text from game people say, might hurt someones rep even though they typed it.

[Vstarstruck]

But what is this assumption based on?

Way people act, if people parser harass now when it violates the ToS and "You do not pay for my sub" is very common to run into, you honestly doubt it would happen?

Legitimate question here, have you actually reported a case of harassment that required a GM's response? Credit where credit is due, SE's GM team are exceptionally hot on this sort of stuff. From what experiences I have (Such as a healer that was trolling in Rabanastre a few months back) they've always been on the ball.

Yeah, but.. I am confused.. since that has nothing to do with what I was saying, why are you asking that?

Honest question. You feel the GMs actually work better in 14 then in WoW. In WoW action was generally swift and sure. Half the GMs in 14 can't even work out some of the rules. Sometimes the dev teams takes weeks to answer if stuff is an actual violation. Also the one time in WoW I had a problem, I had a follow up tell that they wouldn't be bothering anyone for a few days and if they bothered again ask for GM "damn can't remember his name". The couple interactions have seemed to be swift, but did not leave me feeling confident that anything happened. Others I know nothing has happened, for whatever reason SE reacts to cheating.

My biggest issue is lack of community policing that cross server systems create. In 11 and Pre late lich king WoW the community punished those who had issues. This person loots bad, this person boots for friends, this person leaves mid pulls, this person is offensive, and so on. It was always a quick shout any time they tried to create groups. Modern MMO just doesn't have this anymore. Can't even post actual text from game people say, might hurt someones rep even though they typed it.

Oh ya wow is def better with its gms, prob a funding thing

[HoodRat]

Others I know nothing has happened, for whatever reason SE reacts to cheating.

There's a joke I read on Reddit: you're far more likely to be banned for hurting someone's feelings than you are for blatantly hacking.

Way people act, if people parser harass now when it violates the ToS

Once again: even if an official parser is released, harassment will still be against the ToS. This is starting to look like those healer dps threads where the pro side kept saying one thing and the anti said kept arguing against something no one even said ever.

[Vstarstruck]

There's a joke I read on Reddit: you're far more likely to be banned for hurting someone's feelings than you are for blatantly hacking.



Once again: even if an official parser is released, harassment will still be against the ToS. This is starting to look like those healer dps threads where the pro side kept saying one thing and the anti said kept arguing against something no one even said ever.

I addressed comments like that already:

ON FFXIV the only reason you do not see it a lot is because most people know they will be easily hit by a GM when it is reported, and yet PEOPLE STILL DO IT, rarely, but the fact remains it still happens when it is a ToS violation, what do you think will happen if they allow public parers? GM calls be flooded with complaints. That is another reason they do not want to open Pandora's box, it is quite clear they do not get a lot of budget and a small GM team, they wouldn't be able to handle the volume of calls it would bring, on top of large skill gaps, you are just playing with fire, releasing a public parser in this game's state.