Should SE do something about PvE toxitiy?*point PvP change*

[Ilan]

snip

Yeah its all the fault of the evil people who raid. Its not because people simply don't care to play properly, no its the fault of people who do it properly. I would say its more the problem of people who don't give a shit about others.

[BigRed5392]

Yeah its all the fault of the evil people who raid. Its not because people simply don't care to play properly, no its the fault of people who do it properly. I would say its more the problem of people who don't give a shit about others.

the moar dps mentality came from alexander savage though. healers were not forced to dps till that was released. dps didn't spam their buffs at pull till then.
Raid mentalities always bleed into the average content. Look at over watch people who follow the e-sport scene or the 1%, force that meta on to the average players And it ripples.

to play properly is to work with the team. No more or less. People forgot that in 3.0. They wanna do w.e they wanna do and don't care who they step on. Pretty much it is the meta mentality that spreads.

Note i said raid meta/scene... not players

think you need to cool your jets a little and read the whole post, instead of 1 line.

[KDSilver]

My concern with PvE toxicity is why everyone is so bent on DPS? I even had top geared healers myself bragging about their DPS leaving me to basically solo heal the party and putting people down.

If I may say something about this.
Don't get the wrong idea. If that healer didn't care about helping you when he saw you had trouble healing the party, he did wrong and he's just bad... or toxic, whatever.

BUT, know that, personally, I'm part of healers who dps a lot (but also do my job as a healer).
Since a lot of content can be solohealed (meaning that, the heals of one heal alone is enough to keep the party alive), well it's better to do something useful for the party, and dpsing is a way. Reducing the boss HP is all our concern after.

My point is, if you meet healers who let you soloheal, it isn't because they absolutely want to dps, but because your heals may are enough.
If he doesn't help you however if there's more heal than needeed, we can talk about toxicity in that case.

I'm a little sad to see every type of player spitting on eachother playstyle without always knowing players they are with.
I'm not saying that to you Ama, but in general.

Don't say it's raiders fault. It's players sometimes being asses.
That's all.

[LuckiGoLucki]

To confront the main question: why is everyone so bent on dps?

Since day one in ARR this game seemed heavily dependent on teams meeting dps checks in instances. I remember spending most of my time in fights constantly wondering if my current team would be able to pass the dps check. I think it has just become a given now and people are really adamant about every class and job giving the best dps that they can.

It all comes down to Time. People want to clear every run as fast as possible. How do you get through it fast? Killing everything ASAP therefore "dps need to be putting out their best numbers at all times. Healers need to dps when they can and Tanks need to dps when they can."
People can say whatever they want to whomever. The rest of us kind folk need to be able to overlook them and be the better person. I've said it before so I'll say it again: if you find yourself being kicked often you may need to take a hard look at yourself not cry toxicity the first chance you get.

[Watachy]

Yeah its all the fault of the evil people who raid. Its not because people simply don't care to play properly, no its the fault of people who do it properly. I would say its more the problem of people who don't give a shit about others.

Saving the thread, thank you.

[Serilda]

In another dun, my friend wanted more help from this max geared healer, making little comments like you know you need to take cleric off to heal right ? (this was after talking about needing more help and like them to cleric less.) Right when the battle ended this simply left, not a word said.

Why did they say it in such a passive aggressive way? If I slipped up and didn't notice the other healer was struggling and the way they dealt with it was to be sarcastic to me I'd probably get annoyed too. I understand they were frustrated but this was just massively escalating the situation. Maybe the other healer wasn't good at English or was having some other problem. The toxic attitudes go both ways.

[Ama_Hamada]

If I may say something about this.
Don't get the wrong idea. If that healer didn't care about helping you when he saw you had trouble healing the party, he did wrong and he's just bad... or toxic,whatever.

BUT, know that, personally, I'm part of healers who dps a lot (but also do my job as a healer).
Since a lot of content can be solohealed (meaning that, the heals of one heal alone is enough to keep the party alive), well it's better to do something useful for the party, and dpsing is a way. Reducing the boss HP is all our concern after.

My point is, if you meet healers who let you soloheal, it isn't because they absolutely want to dps, but because your heals may are enough.
If he doesn't help you however if there's more heal than needeed, we can talk about toxicity in that case.

I'm a little sad to see every type of player spitting on eachother playstyle without always knowing players they are with.
I'm not saying that to you Ama, but in general.

Don't say it's raiders fault. It's players sometimes being asses.
That's all.

I DPS too, I am sure everyone does. However when people "stand in bad" or make mistakes and they still refuse to help because they are top geared and feel their DPS is so much important, then it is insulting. If it can be solo healed there would not be 2 healers. You do not just clearic stance 24/7 when there is 2 healers letting EoS do all the work and go oh i am healing.

One time I was in lolST with a i90 level sch doing it to me, calling me afk and harassing me over healing when they DPS 24/7 saying eos was doing all the healing and they where damaging bosses. I really wanted kick them but it was treasure > pull making no opportunity to do so.

Why did they say it in such a passive aggressive way? If I slipped up and didn't notice the other healer was struggling and the way they dealt with it was to be sarcastic to me I'd probably get annoyed too. I understand they were frustrated but this was just massively escsalating the situation. Maybe the other healer wasn't good at English or was having some other problem. The toxic attitudes go both ways.

Because they where not responding to the softer comments, as said this was after asking for more help and it was being refused. No spoken word by the person and kept up DPSing when healing was needed.

[Bourne_Endeavor]

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Honestly? These are wannabe raiders. The vast majority don't have some stick up their butt when doing leveling content. Not to mention, this particular Monk sounds more like a troll or an idiot with no idea how to even play. I wouldn't call him a raider.

[Serilda]

Because they where not responding to the softer comments, as said this was after asking for more help and it was being refused. No spoken word by the person and kept up DPSing when healing was needed.

Right; I get why it was frustrating. It's just that being a jerk to someone (being sarcastic absolutely counts) is never going to improve an already-bad situation. By all means dig your heels in and get forceful, but rudely making fun of them to the entire group is rightfully going to annoy people - I'd probably have left too even if I was some irrelevant DPS player not being yelled at. Are you even sure they understood? Ask me to 'cleric less' or vaguely say you're having a hard time without any context and I'll probably have no idea what you mean, and I'm natively fluent in English - a good portion of the playerbase isn't.

I feel like a lot of people are quick to assume the worst when it's their own communication which could use work. I'm not that healer, but I've been in groups with rubbish communicators before and if they're going to work themselves into a tizz and rage at people instead of speaking more clearly then they have to accept they're part of the problem. I don't like playing with people who make fun of others rather than trying to resolve the problem. Sarcasm never resolves problems.

[Ama_Hamada]

Right; I get why it was frustrating. It's just that being a jerk to someone (being sarcastic absolutely counts) is never going to improve an already-bad situation. By all means dig your heels in and get forceful, but rudely making fun of them to the entire group is rightfully going to annoy people - I'd probably have left too even if I was some irrelevant DPS player not being yelled at. Are you even sure they understood? Ask me to 'cleric less' or vaguely say you're having a hard time without any context and I'll probably have no idea what you mean, and I'm natively fluent in English - a good portion of the playerbase isn't.

I feel like a lot of people are quick to assume the worst when it's their own communication which could use work. I'm not that healer, but I've been in groups with rubbish communicators before and if they're going to work themselves into a tizz and rage at people instead of speaking more clearly then they have to accept they're part of the problem. I don't like playing with people who make fun of others rather than trying to resolve the problem. Sarcasm never resolves problems.

Asking for help from a 270 pure gear healer and 275 relic when everyone is under 50% should not be explained in detail what it means when asked "can you help heal a bit more and dps less?"

Casting DPS spells when people are in badly in need of heals is not assuming anything

Dun is STILL A RAID! A place that needs TWO healers, not one, per party.