DEV REQUEST: Remove cast bars to MCH & BRD

[Osmond]

Easy answer to this post, don't use WM/GB. There...done.....

[Duelle]

At least you're not a black mage who might as well be half buried.

A job designed around being a turret becoming even more of a turret (though I could argue BLM would have gotten enough with Laylines and that Enochian was wasted on them since it's a mechanic you could have built an entire new job around) makes sense. A mobile, instant-attack oriented job becoming a turret warrants a "what the hell were they thinking?" type of reaction. Specially taking into account how WM was implemented.

This said, I support the OP in that cast times are terrible on BRD. MCH can sort of get away with it because of how Gauss Barrel interacts with shot procs, and I think it may be enough to help the job stand on its own. BRD should have gotten something else to create diversity in playstyle. Sadly, I don't see it going away until the next expansion kicks in, if we're lucky. It's a big change that would require a redesign of how BRD plays in HW zones. Then again, they did a revamp on WAR's tank model from 2.0 to 2.1, so there is some hope there.

[seekified]

I think Gauss Barrel makes more sense for its job than Wanderer's Minuet does for bards, but it's also a definite fact that I enjoyed MCH more before Gauss Barrel became a thing at 52.

While it's true that the changes that these stances got in recent patches has made the jobs competitive again DPS-wise, I think it's just an odd way of playing ranged jobs. They give you all this mobility to set you apart from other jobs and then give you a shiny new ability that takes it all away - it's just odd, regardless of how it performs.

[AdamFyi]

Understandably Bard isn't the powerhouse people seem to want to think it is.

Mhm. Though, to be quite fair, Minuet charge times are about half of that of the magic casters cast times to boot. It does makes sense why WM doesn't have high potential damage output in that regard too.

However, I do want to point out that Foe's Requiem and Hypercharge doesn't reduce the player's damage at all (only Ballad, Paeon, and Promotion have damage penalties), unless, that isn't what you're implying; if so, whoops, sorry.

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They give you all this mobility to set you apart from other jobs and then give you a shiny new ability that takes it all away - it's just odd, regardless of how it performs.

Actually, not all of it. You still have a leeway to move around as the charge times are less than the GCD. Plus, you can even turn it off if you need to move for an extended period of time so you can still run-'n-gun.

[Aomine1992]

My BRD isn't quite there yet but I'm dreading WM but like any other I will try to alter my play style but I did choose BRD cause it's fun and mobile without those two things I might as well head back to slow fat and chunky BLM (no offense BLM mains I do love the class) or the arthritis DRG is causing me lol

[Daralii]

I think Gauss Barrel makes more sense for its job than Wanderer's Minuet does for bards, but it's also a definite fact that I enjoyed MCH more before Gauss Barrel became a thing at 52.

While it's true that the changes that these stances got in recent patches has made the jobs competitive again DPS-wise, I think it's just an odd way of playing ranged jobs. They give you all this mobility to set you apart from other jobs and then give you a shiny new ability that takes it all away - it's just odd, regardless of how it performs.

If being able to jump in place while DPSing is what sets a job apart, it doesn't have a particularly solid identity. Bard's defined by Ballad and Requiem more than anything.

[NoahArks]

Look. I also seriously hate the castbars, but I'm over it. I got used to it and it's pretty fun. The only thing I hate about the mch is the rng. At times you get the procs, but other times you don't and you're stuck with the cooldowns... That's just the worst design ever. The lack of auto-attack also hurts. You pretty much do more damage without GB if you have a high crit, since auto attacks can crit to

[seekified]

If being able to jump in place while DPSing is what sets a job apart, it doesn't have a particularly solid identity. Bard's defined by Ballad and Requiem more than anything.

Yeah, perhaps "set it apart" wasn't the best way to say it - I mean it more in the sense that as a ranged job, being able to attack on the go seems natural because otherwise the only thing setting you apart from casters are your animations, which I think is what the chief complaint has been for GB/WM (along with the fact that it suddenly changes how the jobs play). The support stuff is fantastic for both jobs and makes a lot of sense for their roles and I agree that it's their signature abilities.

Something that will be interesting to see DPS-wise is just how powerful BRD and MCH will become since a 1.3x modifier on all outgoing damage will become huge as our gear improves. Bards were in a very good place towards the end of 2.x and I imagine we'll look at these jobs quite differently in six months, much like DRG was very looked down upon early on but after the changes in 2.4 became a lot more capable.

[Warlyx]

MCH has less isues with GB because they have procs and way to force procs to be more mobile , we bards no options outside 2 random procs (bloodletter and Straight shot! proc that have both their own issues now)

anyway like i said , 2.0 > 3.0 we are in the same spot dpswise but now we arent that mobile , and thats counting a 30% boost from the stance

how its possible that we gained 30% dmg and we are still doing the same dps compared to others?

others gained 30% too u will think , it only makes sense ,but what other jobs gave to get that 30% boost?

it feels like all the work was put into SMN then others and at the end BRD (copy paste from MCH) , just look at the animations new mechanics and QOL changes....we got the short end of the stick in HW

p.d i still "enjoy" it , and casting was a pain at the begging , but once u get over it meh....but still doesnt feel "fair". (if u played shaman in wow u know what i mean)

[rappa]

180 wep bard = 63 Weapon Damage
180 wep nin-mnk-drg = 70 Weapon Damage.
+7 WD

190 wep bard = 65 Weapon Damage
190 wep nin-mnk-drg = 72 Weapon Damage.
+7 WD

200 wep bard = 67 Weapon Damage
200 wep nin-mnk-drg = 74 Weapon Damage.
+7 WD

210 wep bard = 68 Weapon Damage
210 wep nin-mnk-drg = 76 Weapon Damage.
+8 WD

That is the problem, nor potency, nor skills. Our weapon damage is less than others
dps and the difference is increased final wep stage.

Too afraid to stay the +7 WD difference?