Are healers lazy or do some really live by "I only heal"?

[Sareal]

And ~of course~ using Tetra when that happens get me aggro. Maybe I'm just unlucky, idk

That seems awfully specific. I refuse to believe that this is how all of your runs goes, because it literally only takes 1 AoE from the tank to hold aggro from any kind of healing abilities, assuming they are pulling with their tank stances on. If they are pulling with their DPS stances on, they aren't very smart and simply don't know how to play their role. As a paladin, I can hold the aggro of an entire AoE pack by simply spamming Flash, and even just 1 flash will at least keep aggro from the healer until I pulled everything I intended to pull if they so decide to heal me during the "pull run"

[Nova_Dresden]

That seems awfully specific. I refuse to believe that this is how all of your runs goes, because it literally only takes 1 AoE from the tank to hold aggro from any kind of healing abilities, assuming they are pulling with their tank stances on. If they are pulling with their DPS stances on, they aren't very smart and simply don't know how to play their role. As a paladin, I can hold the aggro of an entire AoE pack by simply spamming Flash, and even just 1 flash will at least keep aggro from the healer until I pulled everything I intended to pull if they so decide to heal me during the "pull run"

It is specific, and it is very common. My fairy has taken quite a few hits from stuff because of her programming. Tank health drops=cast heal. Suddenly a pile of stuff is all over her. It's not every run, but at least 2-3 times a week I have to deal with that kind of a tank.

[Sareal]

It is specific, and it is very common.

I don't find it common, at least not when I heal. Specific, that is unarguable, because any kind of tanks that knows what they are doing won't lose the initial aggro to a heal unless the heal was cast at the very moment the pull was done, which the fairy will rarely ever do, since the HP of the tank has not yet dropped. Don't forget that this particular take on the topic of "tank dying because being in DPS stance" started because (continued)

[Sareal]

If a healer doesn't dps. ;x I just get out of my tanking stance and DPS in full STR gear after setting hate. Might as well increase your damage a bit if their going to contribute 0.

While it is common to find unskilled tanks, it is not specific to the point of generalizing that "DPS stance tank = Dead tank", it's more in the line of "Bad tank using DPS stance will cause these kinds of situations to happen", in which case, this is specific in the sense that you will find noobs in all and every roles. I just don't see how we should look at that specific situation simply because there are less skilled people than others.

[Seku]

And then you die. Great choice, Mr. Tank.
A dungeon is supposed to be teamwork and everyone have their own duties in the team. Yours is lead the way and keep aggro. Mine is heal. If we can do better than that, fine, if not, hold your horses and play with the tune.

And then I kick the healer due to the inability to use their curing abilities and call in an actual half way decent healer from my FC. :3

Mine is to lead the way and I shut down lazy healers and DPS. Period.

No one got time for 30 min+ runs like this is day 1, unless they brand new.

Your last point I strongly will have to disagree. If SE wanted healers to actively and demandingly contribute to the dps on duties, they would have included their dps in their minimum damage in party calculations.

They did. See Salvage clears. The only reason it wasn't required of the healers through normal dungeons is due to the lack of enrage timers. But most DPS and Tanks would run out of TP / MP in fractal before the boss was down when first arriving there, unless the Healer aided in DPSing.

My perception on what the job healer implies is in the word itself. Healer = a guy that heals.

I get that. But too many ways are around to keep the party alive and contribute to dps. Unless the tank sucks, the dps sucks, or either the healer or tank are new.

either way there are optimizations which are controlled by the player himself and his willingness.

You mean lack of willingness to learn to press a few more buttons in easily seen circumstances, that can save everyone 5 minutes at minimal, instead of cure spamming for no reason. If the tank sucks and doesn't know their cool downs, I could then understand a bit.

But I will say this again, a healer's role and purpose is to heal and therefore I don't expect any less mor any more. Any less of that for me is lazy, any more is a bonus.

Laziness (also called indolence) is a disinclination to activity or exertion despite having the ability to do so. There is the definition for you. I'll say it again. I understand if the tank sucks or DPS sucks or the healer is new. ;x But other than that if you're not DPSing, you're being lazy.

On a side note, and on this I completely agree with you guys. If I see a healer jumping around while the party is killing stuff and there is no danger and mp are good, I will call that guy lazy, cause obviously he is not panicking or glueing his eyes on the party menu maybe too shy or unsure to switch to cleric stance. Then definetly yes, LAZY!!!

Good to know you actually agree with me.

While it is common to find unskilled tanks, it is not specific to the point of generalizing that "DPS stance tank = Dead tank", it's more in the line of "Bad tank using DPS stance will cause these kinds of situations to happen", in which case, this is specific in the sense that you will find noobs in all and every roles. I just don't see how we should look at that specific situation simply because there are less skilled people than others.

Was that for me? Because I was advocating tanking in STR gear and DPS stance. And yeah you will find noobs in all roles. Which is why I adjust myself to the players that are around me. If the healer is good enough to DPS, I'll do a mix of vit and str, so they don't have to worry about me. If they are just sitting on their mp and doing nothing, I'll go all out offensive to make up for them being lazy.

[raela]

Healer does 25% of DPS damage? I'd say my single target is about 50% (equal or above bad DPS) and aoe can be even with DPS with few aoe tools. Seriously, it's a good boost to the party. This is based on my friend parsing our DF ex roulette / Alex NM runs (while I micromanage Eos, so heals are still going out).

[ThinkPInk]

These threads are so funny. As s healer I'm there to heal. DPS is optional and an added benefit. I'll dps if I choose to and there is nothing you can do to change that. I'm waiting for the person that comes into a dungeon and tells me how to do my job. You will get shut down very quickly. Trying to kick me would be even funnier because I'm always with friends lol. Let people play the way they want. It's not your place to try and control anyone. What you consider fun is not the same as everyone else.

[SeleneFatalis]

Here's my thing, as a WHM main.

If I am in a dungeon with randoms, I'll focus on healing. About halfway through the dungeon (or sooner), I'll start DPSing, to get it going a little faster and to fill that downtime.

If I am in a dungeon with "my tank", I'll do a mixture, and even see how much I can DPS, because I know what to expect.

As a healer, you don't know what everyone is going to do. Is the tank going to do large pulls? Is he going to use his cooldowns efficiently? Are the dps going to pull aggro constantly? Are they going to avoid aoes? It's hard to tell initially. So when I don't know what to expect, I play it safe, until I see the pattern.

It's all about comfort level for me. I can't speak for everyone though. Maybe some really are lazy.

[Chiramu]

If any healer does not do DPS when there is no healing to be needed do not give them commendations. I never give comms to those people because they sit there and overheal my HP constantly >.>... They don't even know what mitigating abilities are.

[KarstenS]

don't require any healing for at least 4-5 seconds

4 or 5 seconds is not really worth to dance. In that time, I get out 1 DoT and have to switch back. To much stress. To many times clecic didn't disabled after that short time, even if the button showed me, the CD is over.

You have to survive 20-30 seconds without any heal beside the HoTs. Than its worth to start DPSing. There are many tanks that are able to do this. If you are not, than you should not expect to get DPS by healers.

Learn to play your tank class first, before you are starting calling out others lazy.