Still none of the needed changes?

[Garotte14]

Don't be a baddie is all. Learn the fight and quit complaining. That's like me casting enochian 3 seconds before oppressor jumps, and then getting mad at SE for a bad design and raging that my buffs need to be changed or reworked.

[Arienal]

because really there's not such a thing like "beyond player control".

Ok, sure, by all means let me know how you keep rolling combo's on a enemy that becomes invulnerable for some animation. Let me know how you keep hitting something thats jumped out of the arena. Let me know how ignore stun results. Let me know how you keep on hitting when mechanics require you to leave the enemy. Please, enlighten me.

Also, while at least people are discussing blood, ive yet to see anyone with a counterpoint as to the copy/past of fang and wheeling, a term i believe some call 'button bloating'. No point in it existing, but built in a way that requires it to be around. I have had fights where ONLY fang, or ONLY WT proc'd. did my rotation change? no. did my damage change? no. did the effects change? no. there is absolutely no reason for it other than laziness.

[whiskeybravo]

Not another one of these threads ; ;

Seriously.. It's not bad. Nearly every time I've lost BotD in an encounter it's been my fault. Did 1 too many GK.. Popped BotD when I should've waited til after the jump.. Accidentally pressed Heavy Thrust or Phleb instead of my 4th.. etc, etc. It's not just the mechanics, the mechanics are there to try and mess you up, but for every mechanic there's a way to overcome it, a way to optimize your rotation in such a way as to not loose BotD or at least mitigate the time it will be down.

As for WT/FC being "copies" of each other.. Why all the hate with these abilities? I really just don't understand. It took some getting use too but after a few runs its like second nature. Complaining about these just seems like you want something easier to play, because in honesty, what difference does it make if it actually has a different effect? You're still going to do it in the rotation and the DPS numbers are still probably going to be relatively the same due to balance.. So.. There's not really anything to gain.. If you just want to remove the RNG then that's just lazy IMO.. Changing it's effect, though, doesn't really do anything different and you'd still have the same complaints.

[Arienal]

just seems like you want something easier to play

For the love of...i keep saying im not looking for some sort of 'easy mode' design, I have said twice now on this thread, im perfectly fine with it being a challenge. im A-OK with being made to work for it, but thats NOT what any of this is...is anyone who says this even reading what i type?

"Not another one"

Guess what, they're popping up because people are sick of these design flaws. Just watching through the forums shows im far from the only person to bring these issues up, and the majority, though not all, of counter points boil down to "shut up, good damage" or "stop saying you want easy mode" when neither of these are even the main point.

I never stated this is 'too hard' i said its 'crappy design' and i will continue to make new threads on this if i have to in order to keep up visibility on the issue, thats the only way anything's going to change.

[whiskeybravo]

The problem you face is for every 1 of "you" there's 1000 dragoons that don't have any problem with it. The traffic on the forums is astronomically smaller than the entire player base, so just because there are a handful of complaint threads doesn't mean everyone has a problem with or share the same concerns.

All we see is complaint after complaint, never any constructive suggestions. So give me the option, what would replace WT/FC dynamic? What would be so great about this proposal, for us dragoons that don't really have any problem with the current dynamic, that we'd be willing to switch sides and show you support?

[Garotte14]

Guess what, they're popping up because people are sick of these design flaws. Just watching through the forums shows im far from the only person to bring these issues up, and the majority, though not all, of counter points boil down to "shut up, good damage" or "stop saying you want easy mode" when neither of these are even the main point.

That is statistically untrue. People use comment sections, forums, suggestion boxes, etc. to complain. People don't normally use those tools to talk about how great something is. If someone is happy, they're more likely going to keep on playing and never say a word. So yeah, you are going to see most Drg threads on these forums about ppl upset or complaining. But that's probably less than 10% of the population that plays that class. Guess what, the other 90% or are content and happy with what they have.

[Sigmakan]

Not sure how theres a design flaw. BotD is a resource that you need to manage, just like many other systems in this game. The Dark Arts system is like this as well. Yeah the cooldown is only 5seconds, but if you use it every time off of cooldown then you'll quickly run out of MP, which results in lower damage and locking you out of some abilities.

These new systems encourage you to be strategic in how you consume and renew these resources. THATs where the challenge lies. If you want to completely get rid of these systems then you are just asking for simple/easy mode.

[Arienal]

Funny, because the majority of drg's i meet on my own server share these frustrations, while the supporters are the minority.

I already made several proposed changes, yet every time i do put those suggestions up they are always answered with shut up! damage or X job has it worse

To restate a few suggestions i made, drop the timer on botd and add a stacking buff similar to wrath, and have GK based on THAT. this way it still keeps GK a bit limited but without downright killing the buff and crippling the player when things DO go south.

Change the copy/paste build of FnC/WT and make them their own skills. instead of a random proc, change them to follow FT/CT respectively as combo bonuses. with one building the stacks for GK and the other having its own effect, such as reduced tp on next ability to account for ever increasing SS, or something similar to give it its own purpose. This way they each have their own purpose, and dont just get macro'd onto the same button on the hotbar.

[Malevicton]

Rookie mistake. If you wanna make your personal preferences sound like an objective argument, you gotta slip the phrase "artificial difficulty" into it at least 3 times.

[Ephier]

It affects the Dragoon's DPS and at most one Bard or MCH, unless you're stacking BRD/MCH for some reason.

That's not raid DPS.

Considering that the BRD/MCH and DRG is part of the raid, it does indeed boost raid DPS. Your counter arguments in this thread are on some next level ish.