Astro in savage

[LycorisSelunis]

It's good to hear people using noct after so much bashing on it! I have been using it a lot derping around doing lvl 50 things because in higher level play the main reason I prefer diurnal is that 1 or 2 ticks off of CU in an emergency could be lifesaving and noct CU just doesn't seem worth it, and TD doesn't do crap for noct either...Getting both regens and a buffed bole TD on the tank is great breathing room for fixing derp mistakes someone else made, or adding dps of my own....So when I am level synced below those abilities the shields are great.

@Richiealvian Was it no issue double shield with your sch parter because you co-ordinated your shielding, because the damage was constant enough for shields to always be popping, or because one of you didn't shield much and focused more on raw healing? Were one or both you able to dps much?

edit-also did you stack virus/disable and cu/ss or trade off who was using which cd? Basically having more constant cds or having very potent double cd

[Darkseth]

Saw these videos on youtube of this AST Yoshiyuki Ly for those that wanna see.

Floor 1 Savage
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZkTySAHDI4

Floor 2 Savage
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FWfPcG43yrA

Impressive. This gave me much hope for AST, because i like the animations and the Esoteric set. Even more considering the following:
i tried AST (my partner is a sch, so i'm main WHM) today in A1s.
I was hoping, people here in xx Threads would just exaggerate with how bad AST really is...
Honestly, AST is just SO bad and pretty much Useless in any serious raid scenario. Sure, it IS possible as shown in above videos. Sure, its "fine" on lower content below Alex savage. But double Warrior in 2.0 was also possible. Remember that Double warrior T5 clear? Just because it was possible, doesnt mean it's fine. PLD was way better. Just like whm or sch are way better healer than ast now.
But the difference between whm/sch, and any AST combo is so huge...
we had hard problems with Faust, took us like 30 minutes to bring it down. I had non stop zero Mana (and here i was hoping, people would exaggerate too.. Because potency are ONLY 5% lower, but Spell cost 20% less MP) during the end. The heal output is bad, and the buffs were almost worthless. I was even lucky with buffs, and draw like 2-3 attack speed for our Monk, one of them an extendet one + time dilation + CO, which got his dps up by like 50-100 in total? difficult to say... He was just slightly above the drg. My own DPS were stuck at 130, because i just HAD to heal so much.
On Opressor it was also very noticable. My sch partner had to AOE much more, had more MP problems, could dps less. Buffs again... Mostly useless junk. Way too weak to be noticed by any means, unlike the missing healing.
Went out before time up, i changed to war, we oneshotet Faust. I had 280 dps, and had an super easy time healing, without MP problems (endet the fight with 2500-3000 MP ). I probably could have re-newed my dots 1-2 more times.
And during Boss it was similar. Keeping everyone alive was noticable easier and better, than with ast. Despite so little differences in AOE heals. (maybe it was the Mind difference, that gets higher, the higher our Item level goes, since its a flat 3% bonus).
Not to mention, going ast just puts a higher stress on your co-healer, making him less efficient, and maybe even lowering raid dps at all.

Honestly i see 3 ways to fix this job, without a complete rework:
- Bring Healing up to whm/sch level, including potencies. Healing output needs a good buff here
- Cards need to get a HUGE buff. At least 10% -> 40%. The Healing deficite is SO enourmous in my opinion (my whole group noticed it, not just me, and not just my scholar partner), that buffs need to make up for that loss. 10% is just way too low.
- A combination of both.

Since #1 would make it into a whm/sch clone with a different weapon, i guess #2 would be the first pick.

Again: Just looking at potencies, i cant understand why it makes such a big difference. But it does... ;/ i guess, all the small things just add up.

But lets see the positive: SE "has" to do a major Buff (at a similar level as 2.0 warrior) at some point, so we can look forward in a better AST.

[Rahaya]

Considering I currently solo heal Faust to 50-40% on my AST with plenty of MP leftover (and no cards), I'm not entirely sure it's the class to blame there. AST needs some buffs, but no, it's not terrible.

[Darkseth]

The problem is not the first half, its more the 2nd one.
And you can't possibly compare that, since you probably dont run 2 warriors, that sometimes feel like paper
With a PLD and/or DRK instead double warrior, that might look different.
But it wont change the fact, that as WHM its much easier. And that was my point. Not "ast is bad, i cant heal anything", its "ast is bad, because it has a more difficult time than whm/sch".

Like i said. Warrior could tank T5 in 2.0 also, but it was still bad.

Ast just brings pretty much zero benefit at the moment to the Raid. Even worse, in most cases, it gets worse with overall dps, and safety. And that is something, that shouldn't be.

[Xenohart]

Considering I currently solo heal Faust to 50-40% on my AST with plenty of MP leftover (and no cards), I'm not entirely sure it's the class to blame there. AST needs some buffs, but no, it's not terrible.

The only thing terrible was using this as an example of why AST isn't terrible.

[Noira]

AST isn't terrible though.

Also everyone does know Astro has a perma potency buff in the form of Noc stance ? 5% is nothing to scoff at.

I prefer Noc over Regen stance because there are tons of fights where I need to heal big and that 5% is very helpful.

Also Ewer is a god send now and was an indirect buff to Noc as light speed was. ( why you would use light speed in regen stance Idk I never bothered with it)

[Alahra]

( why you would use light speed in regen stance Idk I never bothered with it)

You would use it for the same reasons in both stances, really. You don't typically want to spam Aspected Helios, as you don't want to overwrite the regen effects in Diurnal and you don't want to overwrite the shields on your party in Nocturnal. You want to use Benefic/Helios when Lightspeed is up, so whether you have regens or shields is irrelevant to its use.

[Vlady]

Darkseth I am not sure if you are serious or trolling. Astrologian is a far cry from what you say.they are near the same strength as the other healers. They need at most a minuet tweak to let us pay of the strength of the job which is flexibility by letting us access both stances in battle somehow.other then that we are on par with the other two jobs.

[EchuKayu]

AST isn't terrible though.

Also everyone does know Astro has a perma potency buff in the form of Noc stance ? 5% is nothing to scoff at.

I prefer Noc over Regen stance because there are tons of fights where I need to heal big and that 5% is very helpful.

Also Ewer is a god send now and was an indirect buff to Noc as light speed was. ( why you would use light speed in regen stance Idk I never bothered with it)

Ewer is also a card that gives you the chance to groupwide buff everyone. Basically if you're low on mana and without LA, you're forcefully using a card for your mana and sacrificing supporting your party. it's great we can use spear and ewer that way, I just don't agree with it at all.

Of course they aren't terrible, no one is saying they are. However, being able to do content isn't a justification for, say, their cards and support not being where it should be.

Also, why is our healing potency lower? We don't have the CDs/utility/cross class other healers do, which is made up for by cards. So, why do we lack the same potency as the other two healers? We already sacrifice what makes us similar to them, like our crits not giving a crit shield.

[Cynfael]

AST isn't terrible though.

Also everyone does know Astro has a perma potency buff in the form of Noc stance ? 5% is nothing to scoff at.

I prefer Noc over Regen stance because there are tons of fights where I need to heal big and that 5% is very helpful.

- AST is not terrible, but it is disadvantaged.

- I do scoff at Noct's 5% potency buff because it doesn't come close to making up the gap in efficiency between the two Sects. AST spells are strong enough with or without the tiny 5% buff; the problem is in the lack of potent healing CDs for those short spurts when you need dramatically increased healing, which applies to both Sects. At least with Diurnal the baseline maintenance healing is much less MP-intensive, the regens free up more GCDs and MP for the caster, and somewhat better synergy with CU (lol...but still) and CO is enjoyed.