Ways to fix BRD and MCH in a realistic way

[Intellion]

so wrong it's not funny. bards are taken because without them every other job would run out of tp/mp.

without bard the overall dps would drop abysmally.

all you went over is you have no idea how to play your own job.

No. All you've shown is that you have no clue how to actually play Bards and don't know what the hell you are talking about, yet you are snarkily commenting on a Bard feedback thread like this one.

Even in hardcore raids like coils, Bards are only asked to turn on their TP/MP songs when absolutely needed. After enough TP or MP is recovered, we are immediately asked to shut them off.

Why? Because in the end, we still consume a DPS slot, and hence are expected to pump out DPS. If you knew how to play Bards you'd also know that songs severely damage our DPS. But I guess you wouldn't. A Lv 24 Archer wouldn't have access to songs yet, after all.

With our low damage, how do we pump out the required DPS? By utilizing our trump card... mobility and rapid oGCD/proc weaving! Gasp! Who knew?!

As I keep saying, songs are undoubtedly useful, but it's just our sidearm.

It sure as hell weren't songs that helped me meet the tight DPS checks required on EX primals and Final Coil bosses when I cleared them as a Bard.

Once again, another PSA to non-Bards:

Please refrain from snarky comments unless you actually know enough about how to properly play the job well.

[Musashidon]

Please refrain from snarky comments unless you actually know enough about how to properly play the job well.

what you don't get is your dps doesn't matter your boost to the other dps do.

like i said learn you job.

it doesn't matter if i am a bard or not why? because your taken as a mp/tp potion nothing else.

snip

mobility has nothing to do with it.

you could be up close melee or long cast bards.

you are not brought for mobility at all.

The boost we do to other dps? You mean the one song we have that affects only a third of the entire DPS cast? One that only lasts so long because of a finite pool of resource used for the song?

This guy is for real, lmao.

let's see you beat a raid without a bard when your tank/melee dps are out of tp and your healers are out of mp, and you are doing zero damage and dying because noone is getting heals.

[Lewtskie]

what you don't get is your dps doesn't matter your boost to the other dps do.

like i said learn you job.

it doesn't matter if i am a bard or not why? because your taken as a mp/tp potion nothing else.

The boost we do to other dps? You mean the one song we have that affects only a third of the entire DPS cast? One that only lasts so long because of a finite pool of resource used for the song?

This guy is for real, lmao.

And way to entirely miss what I said. But of course, you chose to ignore that, since it was an actual point that you couldn't contest.

This is just taking the piss.

let's see you beat a raid without a bard when your tank/melee dps are out of tp and your healers are out of mp, and you are doing zero damage and dying because noone is getting heals.

NAH MAN, you said it yourself that only the boost we do to other DPS do is what matters. Don't backpedal.

[Intellion]

what you don't get is your dps doesn't matter your boost to the other dps do.

like i said learn you job.

it doesn't matter if i am a bard or not why? because your taken as a mp/tp potion nothing else.



mobility has nothing to do with it.

you could be up close melee or long cast bards.

you are not brought for mobility at all.

No. Just, no.

You have proven that you have no idea what you're saying.

We are only taken as "MP/TP pots?"

Wrong.

We are taken as a DPS class to fill in a DPS slot to pump out DPS like the other three DPS slots. Songs are just there as a safety measure. Sometimes, parties even rely on our mobility to handle mechanics while maintaining DPS.

I don't need to "learn" my job, because I have mastered it already.

Perhaps you should learn not to comment stupid things on subjects you know nothing about.

And why not level Bard to 60, or something? Then take it to raids. Might teach you a thing or two.

I just find it asinine that non-Bards who have never played or mained the class are going into Bard feedback threads, acting all high-and-mighty, and insulting actual Bards when they don't even have a single clue about the job they're criticizing.

[Musashidon]

I don't need to "learn" my job, because I have mastered it already.

Perhaps you should learn not to comment stupid things on subjects you know nothing about.

And why not level Bard to 60, or something? Then take it to raids. Might teach you a thing or two.

obviously not when you *don't need songs and you are dps* lol

NAH MAN, you said it yourself that only the boost we do to other DPS do is what matters. Don't backpedal.

how am i back pedaling? i said you need bards for tp/mp songs without them you lose.

like i said beat a raid without those songs.

[Intellion]

obviously not when you *don't need songs and you are dps* lol



how am i back pedaling? i said you need bards for tp/mp songs without them you lose.

like i said beat a raid without those songs.

And now you're resorting to putting words in my mouth because you know that my statements are true?

"Don't need songs."

What a joke. Never once have I said such a thing.

But yes, Bards are a DPS class. Tell me, look at their class icon and see what color it is. It sure as heck ain't green or blue.

When Bards queue up for DF, which slot do they get placed at?

"Bards are not DPS."

What a stupid and asinine claim. Please study more about the subject you are commenting on before actually saying something snarky.

I know I wouldn't comment on a Paladin feedback thread because I don't main the class, and hence I'm aware that I know nothing about it and my opinions are null and void.

Yet here you are, commenting on the Bard feedback thread despite not knowing a single thing about how to play Bards properly.

[Musashidon]

What a stupid and asinine claim. Please study more about the subject you are commenting on before actually saying something snarky.

oh bards are dps? then we can just take a better one in your place? right? cause those songs aren't important your mobility is?

[Intellion]

oh bards are dps? then we can just take a better one in your place? right? cause those songs aren't important your mobility is?

Songs are important. They are our valuable utility tool, after all.

But our mobility is more important. You'd only fail to see this if you look at the situation from a non-Bard perspective.

Our mobility is literally the only thing that allows us to maintain sufficient DPS despite our naturally low damage and fulfill our roles as a DPS class.

What Minuet, as of now, is doing is taking away that mobility while giving us nothing in return, meaning that we can no longer maintain acceptable DPS in movement-heavy fights should SE force us into being in WM all the time. Try doing sufficient DPS with Minuet on Titan EX or even just on the final boss of Neverreap. I can assure you, it's a nightmare.

I have discussed this over and over, and I don't feel like repeating it all over again. Feel free to scroll back to earlier pages.

Plus, what color are a Bard's class icon?

Red.

What does red stand for?

DPS.

Please tell me that you know that. There's no "ifs", "buts" or any sort of arguing against that. Bard is a DPS. That's a FACT, not an OPINION.

[Snugglebutt]

-snip-

Stop posting in a thread about a class you clearly have no clue about.

I find it interesting the most verbal opponents yet most ignorant of the class in these threads tends to mostly come from people who claim to know the class despite not even having a capped bard themselves. The amount of fear mongering about possible changes by those of other classes stinks of wanting to screw over this class or machinist to make themselves look better in group composition or plain old ignorance. Perhaps stick to threads you might have a better understanding of such as your own class ones instead of spouting nonsense in different class ones you have no experience playing in endgame content at capped level and fully unlocked/used skills.

Just because you have an opinion about something which potentially have little to no practical experience with and you on the outside looking in does not make that opinion worth much, the people SE need to listen to about the problems with bards and machinists are the players who actually do play them, have the practical experience of using them in high level content using all the skills themselves on the class itself and not other players of other classes just throwing in ignorant or fear mongering comments. I also dislike when a low level archer or bard thinks they know what it is like to play at capped level using skills they have yet to unlock, in the sense of them arguing with those bards who have spent a lot of time experiencing all the skills it has at the capped level in high end content. Practical experience with the class trumps theory crafting and generic opinions of other class players.

It is becoming very annoying when people who do not play a class come into threads talking about them as though they know the class when clearly they don't and I see this all the time whenever a class thread comes up other classes pop in and voice their opinion on it despite having no practical experience playing it themselves. The class discussion is better suited to those whom are both informed and experienced in using it. Why don't you start a bard, cap it and experience what it is like to play in endgame content using all the skills on that class...then come back and have a more insightful opinion on it. Not all bards who have such practical experience agree with each other but at least in those cases they are coming from a position of experience and first hand knowledge instead of random guess work, inexperienced assumption and mere outside theory crafting.

[Musashidon]

Stop posting in a thread about a class you clearly have no clue about.

I find it interesting the most verbal opponents yet most ignorant of the class in these threads tends to mostly come from people who claim to know the class despite not even having a capped bard themselves. The amount of fear mongering about possible changes by those of other classes stinks of wanting to screw over this class or machinist to make themselves look better in group composition or plain old ignorance.

so just like the others instead of actually having a discussion the only thing you have to refute my arguments is nu huh you aren't lvl 60 like me. seriously?

there is no fear mongering. bards lack dps due to the giant role they play in raids. one that no other job can replace.

Do you see how stupid this sounds? It's how you sound.

oh to exaggerations now huh? come on guys graspin straws now?

bards job is not to keep up with everyone else in dps it's why it's lower.