Can someone give me an in-depth explanation why Summoner is arguably the worst DPS?

[Sunako]

Another suggestion would be change flare cooldown to 5min so it would be like enkindle but still hit lot harder and blm would not be so much stronger than smn in aoe.

[Skeith-Adeline]

Another suggestion would be change flare cooldown to 5min so it would be like enkindle but still hit lot harder and blm would not be so much stronger than smn in aoe.

Hell no. Like, really? I can't even lol.

[scarebearz]

Another suggestion would be change flare cooldown to 5min so it would be like enkindle but still hit lot harder and blm would not be so much stronger than smn in aoe.

Ah yes, of course, lets greatly nerf the other casting class, so that melee can truely dominate any dps spot.

5min cd flare, would make BLM weaker than SMN in both aoe and single target imo, which I'm sure is what half of the people here want, but all that does is make casters in general ever more sucky then they are now.

No.. it really isnt.

Why do people think SE has a Vendetta against SMN? They didnt have one against DRG, and they dont now. SMN merely needs some small changes to hit the level of BLM. Im pretty sure a lot of you people asking for drastic changes dont even attempt content that matteers (IE: Your sad because SMN cant AoE like a BLM in dungeons that dont matter anyways. Dungeons that you can complete in i90 gear.)

This is what they need-
#1: Something to help with MP consumption to allow the SMN to play more free with their OGCDs
#2: A very very slight potency buff somewhere in their kit.

THAT IS IT. Those two small changes should bring the SMN to the level of BLM when both are played to the absolute maximum because lets face it thats who is really affected by this. The game should not be balanced around poetry heros that dont even attempt the content that you actually have to play well to push.

This sums it up very well imo, I suspect many of the people complaining for extreme changes are not doing end game content and probably not pushing their class anywhere near it's potential.

[Akiza]

Ah yes, of course, lets greatly nerf the other casting class, so that melee can truely dominate any dps spot.

5min cd flare, would make BLM weaker than SMN in both aoe and single target imo, which I'm sure is what half of the people here want, but all that does is make casters in general ever more sucky then they are now.



This sums it up very well imo, I suspect many of the people complaining for extreme changes are not doing end game content and probably not pushing their class anywhere near it's potential.

Players that are complaining have already switched to Black Mage or Ninja for endgame because its easier to reach max potential on those jobs then Summoner. Why play a class that's hard to play and get mediocre results for all that effort when players can choose a class that's easy to pick up and play and get great results for less the work.

It all boils down to efficiency and Summoner is the least efficient dps.

[Skeith-Adeline]

Why play a class that's hard to play and get mediocre results for all that effort when players can choose a class that's easy to pick up and play and get great results for less the work.

Because it's fun lol. If you have to switch to BLM to meet checks, then it is more of a raid issue than a SMN issue lol

[scarebearz]

Players that are complaining have already switched to Black Mage or Ninja for endgame because its easier to reach max potential on those jobs then Summoner.

There are still many many summoners around, on my server atleast.

It's not about being "easier to reach max potential" anyway, but's about max potential dps over fights as long as FCoB being a bit lower.

I bet if many people spent less time on here complaining about SMN and practice in game, they could be doing a lot more DPS anyway.

[SomnusNemoris]

Ah yes, of course, lets greatly nerf the other casting class, so that melee can truely dominate any dps spot.

5min cd flare, would make BLM weaker than SMN in both aoe and single target imo, which I'm sure is what half of the people here want, but all that does is make casters in general ever more sucky then they are now.
This sums it up very well imo, I suspect many of the people complaining for extreme changes are not doing end game content and probably not pushing their class anywhere near it's potential.

It doesn't, though. First of all, if you actually compare the BLM DPS chart with the SMN one you will find:
MAX DPS BLM T10 - 583 | Max DPS SMN - 514
MAX DPS BLM T11 - 543 | Max DPS SMN - 495
MAX DPS BLM T12 - 543 | Max DPS SMN - 504
MAX DPS BLM T13 - 515 | Max DPS SMN - 492

Even in movement heavy fights such as T11 and 13, BLM still outshines SMN. You honestly think a small buff will fix the problem? Not to mention that Sen his own DPS is far behind was really good BLM do. I don't consider myself a super BLM, but I outDPS him by 30 at least on every single turn. What small potency buff do you have in mind? One where you still are behind BLM in AoE and ST damage aspect? (Also note that Somnus is my alt)
I think from these numbers, it is crystal clear, that SMN needs more than just a small buff and an MP fix.

What else can we deduct from this?
T10 should be more of a SMN fight with the Bane. But as it shows, the difference is 70 DPS. Which over a 10 minute fight is like what? 70*60*10= 42000 damage extra. This in a fight that is mostly single target and has perfect conditions for SMN.
T11 is a complete ST fight, as a SMN you can actually also dot other stuff. Yet BLM triumphs again. So, movement heavy fight, targets that can be dotted and yet BLM still wins
T12 A lot of AoE, BLM should reign surpreme and so it does. Although it must be said that baning those Benus can be pretty sweet too. But overall BLM should win on this fight and so it does. I have seen BLM do more than 543 DPS as well.
T13, can be a bit of movement with earth shakers and AoE is favourable for both. Especially since you can Bane the Storm and little dragons and also the final add. It's movement heavy so overall I think SMN should have the edge, but only by a small margin. Yet we see that BLM has the advantage, even in a rather movement heavy fight (potentionally).

Can we please stop pretending as if Summoner is close to BLM? It is outshined in ST, AoE and utility departement.

[Minorinz]

-

Nicely put. In theory Summoner should be doing more but in reality it isn't. Those deductions are simply becoming facts.

[scarebearz]

Snip

Those numbers mean very little at the moment, the BLM chart has about double the entrys and a much wider mix of severs. (SMN one having mainly results from Gilgamesh, because the creator asked people he/she knew)

When the BLM one had less entrys the numbers were a lot lower too, comparing a small sample to a bigger one is always going to be biased.

Also note I have not said that SMN does not need some fixing, but Nerfing BLM to SMN's current level (likely below with a 5m CD Flare), is not going to help casters/SMN's one bit.

Even on those more AoE heavy fights melee have the potential to do more dps, going by the numbers I've seen atleast.

Imo BLM is exactly where it should and SMN needs some small changes to bring it up on par.