I want to stop playing Summoner.... But I cant

[Kinseykinz]

Damn, sounds harsh on Primal data center. I hardly ever see people get kicked on Chaos (Europe) unless they are actually doing nothing (offline/afk).

And my SMN use to get 2-4 comme's on ave doing content...on Primal Data Center.

And I didn't do the 'standard' rotations all the time b/c the way I do it works better for me/was higher dps for me.

Actually, I've never been vote-kicked from a party....on any role...on Primal Data Center.


As to the 'buff the SMN' bandwagon. Players in MMO's always flock the the current in thing. Right now, SMN is being back-burnered by the playerbase. The expansion will likely 'fix' this. In the meantime, a capable SMN is still able to do ALL the content in the game. Now are they always 'the best DD for the job?' No. But NO DD is 100% of the time the 'best DD' And yes, right now, the FCOB ppl are leaning more BLM>SMN...but that is how the endgamer min/max crowd works...just because the min/maxers say 'this is the best way' doesn't ever mean it's the ONLY way.

[Cxplorer]

So far,I enjoy this class better than the other ones. Less boring and I can solo stuff.

[Raiker]

And my SMN use to get 2-4 comme's on ave doing content...on Primal Data Center.

And I didn't do the 'standard' rotations all the time b/c the way I do it works better for me/was higher dps for me.

Actually, I've never been vote-kicked from a party....on any role...on Primal Data Center.


As to the 'buff the SMN' bandwagon. Players in MMO's always flock the the current in thing. Right now, SMN is being back-burnered by the playerbase. The expansion will likely 'fix' this. In the meantime, a capable SMN is still able to do ALL the content in the game. Now are they always 'the best DD for the job?' No. But NO DD is 100% of the time the 'best DD' And yes, right now, the FCOB ppl are leaning more BLM>SMN...but that is how the endgamer min/max crowd works...just because the min/maxers say 'this is the best way' doesn't ever mean it's the ONLY way.

I honestly could not agree more with this statement. Summoner has been my main since 2.1. Like Kinsey said, take a look as who's saying summoner is poor DPS. It's just about damn near all FCoB people.

[Lavieh]

I honestly could not agree more with this statement. Summoner has been my main since 2.1. Like Kinsey said, take a look as who's saying summoner is poor DPS. It's just about damn near all FCoB people.

You should balance to the top-end players, AKA the min/maxers because balance doesn't mean anything in the lower levels of play.

[Akiza]

The Summoner right now is balanced around the lower levels of play not min/maxers that's why it's left out of FCOB learning parties. Waiting for other team members to get over geared for FCOB is pointless because by then raid statics are going to want experience players not people just getting iinto FCOB.

[Tex_Mex]

The Summoner right now is balanced around the lower levels of play not min/maxers that's why it's left out of FCOB learning parties. Waiting for other team members to get over geared for FCOB is pointless because by then raid statics are going to want experience players not people just getting iinto FCOB.

I don't always agree with Akiza, but on this one I do. Classes need to be balanced around end game, since it is the most competitive aspect of the game. Balance in content that everyone is overgeared for anyways does not matter. Sure, I can take my SMN into almost all content in the game and do ok. Hell I even took mine into T11 last night because our BLM was out sick. There was no doubt that it made the fight more difficult than it needed to be.

[ChazNatlo]

You should balance to the top-end players, AKA the min/maxers because balance doesn't mean anything in the lower levels of play.

Well, you could unbalance a class at lower levels of play. I mean, some of the suggestions are to up the DPS of a SMN so that it can use ED without dropping too low, but in any situation where you don't really need to worry about MP, would this not give a rather large boost to it's standard DPS numbers, since they'd have the boosted numbers AND three Festers.

Of course there is a bit more wiggle room at lower levels, and Balance comes most into play when everyone is playing at their best, presumably in more difficult content, but there should be some semblance of balance at both levels of play. ((If for no other reason than to avoid giving players a false understanding of their classes power.))

[Lavieh]

Snippet

At lower levels of play people play with varying skills and perform at varying values. No ones DPS will every break above the ceiling that is capable in higher level play though, so no one will ever be considered broken/OP. So, no, you can't really "break" a class in the lower end of things. On top of all that balance is meaningless because DPS typically plays no major role in completion when doing easier content.

[Tex_Mex]

Of course there is a bit more wiggle room at lower levels, and Balance comes most into play when everyone is playing at their best, presumably in more difficult content, but there should be some semblance of balance at both levels of play. ((If for no other reason than to avoid giving players a false understanding of their classes power.))

It is impossible to balance around lower levels of play because the differences in player skill at those levels are massive. Easiest way to see this is just to look around during an ST. When you are fighting a single target and some ninja dropped a doton........ we all know what it means. When you watch a DRG who never uses heavy thrust.......yep. When you see a bard that is not using venomous bite or windbite...... yaaaaa. No amount of balance can ever account for people who do not play at a high level.

Casual players are not always bad players, but bad players are always casual players.

[Kinseykinz]

I don't always agree with Akiza, but on this one I do. Classes need to be balanced around end game, since it is the most competitive aspect of the game. Balance in content that everyone is overgeared for anyways does not matter. Sure, I can take my SMN into almost all content in the game and do ok. Hell I even took mine into T11 last night because our BLM was out sick. There was no doubt that it made the fight more difficult than it needed to be.

Yes, this is true...but you also can't judge endgame by ONE type of content.
Especially when no matter what content you're doing, we have typically 4 party slots open to 'DPS roles' and 6 available roles to fill them. No matter how you cut the cookie, someone's getting left out. In the past, it was melee. People basically preferred 2 mages/1 bard/1 melee. Now with the DRG adjustments, NIN being added, and some of the mechanic's issues/longevity that happens in Final Coil, parties are preferring to go in with 2 melee and 2 ranged...one ranged still being given to bard.

Also, this is content that currently is mostly being done by 'dedicated teams'...meaning the actual roles people play is less important in favor of group synergy. Many groups simply found it easier to go in with a BLM over having both BLM/SMN...they had to pick one. But again, it's not as much SMN sucks as much as 'finally, content people prefer having 2 melee in' ...but 2 melee come at the cost of having 2 mages. 2 of ANY mages.

Still, the next flavor of the month endgame elite content to come out....it might be all caster heavy again.
...or the new, level 50+ skillsets each role gains might change the dynamics again as well
...or things might be re-balanced

It's ONE type of content. Basing whether or not you wish to continue to play a role (which is what the OP was about), based on ONE type of content is silly. Play what you want...if it needs to be rebalanced, it will be...but also, it's not near as bad as people make it out to be. This content is currently clearable with a SMN in the party. Some might say 'but it's harder'....maybe that 'harder' is what SE intended, and people not doing it that way are actually pushing above and beyond what SE expected (which happens often btw...take the recent 'NIN nerfs' as an example).

Basically, your idea of 'balanced' might not be SE's idea of 'balanced' Nor is basing your idea of balance on ONE series of battles atm really wise. If every new endgame set of content introduced over the next several patches had a 'SMN issue', then yes, your side would have a point (which is what DID happen to DRGs). But one new series of content...one major patch away from an expansion/level cap increase, nothing to sweat over. Huge adjustments to ALL roles (including the addition of 3 more raid jobs), inc.

So people who love and main SMN, hang tight. It's only one patch of content.
People who bandwagon...be ready to have to totally re-gear when 3.0 lands because you need to jump onto the next wagon...whatever role that might now be.