Dragoons: A Rotation Reborn

[Apoc]

Merry christmas to all the goons that stuck with the job since day 1!

Dervy we had sooooo much trouble getting a bard on Moogle, i think its just the server having so many unreliable ones, hopefully santa bard will bring ya a good one soon!

[Vampyren]

Can any maths nerds here tell me whether it is worth building towards a 440-ish skill speed set against the 410 DET or crafted BiS?
I quite like the idea of my starting BFB lasting through the initial CT and 2 Full Thrusts before wearing off; and also BFB being up for 2 Phlebs before dropping off.

However I'm not sure whether building towards a 440SS set is worth the offset in other parameters like DET and Crit especially at low skill speeds where life surge can be used for CT in the 'new' rotation.

I'm strictly thinking in a min/max point of view and want numbers. So if anyone can run a 440SS and relevant rotation (where BFB is used just before first CT) through their DPS solver and compare it to the other BiS sets, that would be great!

[Dervy]

Are you talking with selene buff? Because at 440 skillspeed, it's impossible to do that without Selene.

[Vampyren]

It is very possible to do without Selene buff. You need to delay popping BFB until the GCD for CT is at about the 8 o'clock position then proceed to be diligent and mash away at all your other buttons so not to delay GCD any further. I can achieve this under no lag at about 332SS but under high latency encounters will require about 440ish

Edit: by no lag I mean dummy fights

[Dervy]

I guess that could work. The "burst" would be much higher, clearly, but there won't be an overall DPS gain over a long period of time. But what you may end up encountering in the long run, is Blood for Blood not properly aligning up with your GDCs and unable to have buffed Chaos Thrusts. It's risky.

I personally wouldn't do it.

[Vampyren]

I've been using this rotation for a long time now and it's what I'm used to. But is the burst dps even that much greater than the no SS or crafted BiS? I'm beginning to doubt the effectiveness of this build since this patch as you can drop so much skill speed and gain a sizeable increase in DET and Crit. What I'd like to know is the theoretical dps values of the different sets comparatively when plugged through a solver over a set period of time, e.g. 1min / 3min/ 5min etc.

As for BFB not aligning... You'll find that the 2nd BFB aligns quite well with Phlebotomise - and you apply it the same way you do for the first CT to squeeze out 2x buffed Ph. Generally though, as the way encounters in this game are designed, you'll have to move around as the fight goes on anyways so in the long run, CTs may not necessarily align with BFB depending on the fight regardless of which rotation or set you use.

Anyways, I would be very grateful if anyone could crunch some numbers and show the theoretical dps values compared over set intervals of time. I'm not 100% sure the SS build is worth the offset so if anyone has any data to prove one or the other, that would clear things up a lot.

For the sake of min/maxing.

[Aiurily]

It is very possible to do without Selene buff. You need to delay popping BFB until the GCD for CT is at about the 8 o'clock position then proceed to be diligent and mash away at all your other buttons so not to delay GCD any further. I can achieve this under no lag at about 332SS but under high latency encounters will require about 440ish

Edit: by no lag I mean dummy fights

assuming you mean 432 skillspeed, since 332 isn't achievable at level 50

the minimum to fit 2 full thrusts/phlebotomizes in bfb duration is 365 skill speed, and that's with a 0.1s~ tight timing and either a clipped gcd or perfectly timed bfb towards the end of gcd. if you always fit in ft or ph it ends up being 1.35 extra pps in your rotation or so, but that doesn't account for any possible sacrifices you'd have to make (stats, clipped gcds, etc)

on content that you can afford having selene, if you have her skillspeed buff going up 50% of the time, having excess skillspeed becomes less valuable because her skillspeed buff is more than enough to achieve the same results (2 ft/ph in one bfb), even at 0 skillspeed.

although it's not stopping me from doing 31det/22crit/22 skillspeed on my zodiac for fun (and because im poor)

as for if the gimmick is actually worth it, it just depends on how much you personally value skill speed as a stat other than for hitting an extra skill in bfb. i think it's worth it at the bare minimum of 365; but 420+ while sacrificing det or more crit than skillspeed probably isnt

[Jeckyl_Tesla]

I wanted to check if my opening rotation is a good one or if I'm doing anything wrong on it.

HT (IR) > PH > ID (PS) > DS (BfB) > CT (Jump) > TT (DFD) > VT (LS) > FT (SSD) > HT (Potent Posioning Potion) > PH (Leg Sweep) > TTT > CT combo

The reason I put PH up first, is because I haven't seen the DPS increase from using it after CT. Phlebotomize as far as I know, isn't affected by piercing resistances, well the DoT part isn't. So the only thing it gains is from the BfB. But is delaying your PHle for 3 GCDs a dps loss or increase?

[Daweism]

I wanted to check if my opening rotation is a good one or if I'm doing anything wrong on it.

HT (IR) > PH > ID (PS) > DS (BfB) > CT (Jump) > TT (DFD) > VT (LS) > FT (SSD) > HT (Potent Posioning Potion) > PH (Leg Sweep) > TTT > CT combo

The reason I put PH up first, is because I haven't seen the DPS increase from using it after CT. Phlebotomize as far as I know, isn't affected by piercing resistances, well the DoT part isn't. So the only thing it gains is from the BfB. But is delaying your PHle for 3 GCDs a dps loss or increase?

The initial hit of 170 potency from Phleb is not affected by piercing debuff?

[Dervy]

H IDC P TTT is only a 0.5 PPS increase over what you use. You will not notice the difference in combat at all.

And Daweism, the 170 potency attack is affected by Disembowl. The DoT's aren't however, that's correct.