When is it OK to say, "It's Not OK"

[Prototype909]

Selling runs is perfectly acceptable if people are willing to pay for it. Nobody is forcing anyone to buy runs, nor is anyone going to be able to force someone to do something for free when they could get paid to do it.

Do you walk up to a crafter and expect them to make whatever you want for free? They put in the time to achieve something so they get to charge for their services when dealing with people who did not put in any time, it's no different.

[odintius]

Selling runs is perfectly acceptable if people are willing to pay for it. Nobody is forcing anyone to buy runs, nor is anyone going to be able to force someone to do something for free when they could get paid to do it.

Do you walk up to a crafter and expect them to make whatever you want for free? They put in the time to achieve something so they get to charge for their services when dealing with people who did not put in any time, it's no different.

Unless their RMT's doing this as well it a great way to get fast gil they be stupid not to attempt this player A buys gil just to give it back to seller= profit just a thought.

[NyarukoW]

Unless their RMT's doing this as well it a great way to get fast gil they be stupid not to attempt this player A buys gil just to give it back to seller= profit just a thought.

The RMT and clear sellers are probably in cahoots, but of course if they are smart they will have some sort of gil laundering scheme so they do NOT get their important accounts banned, and it makes it all the harder to any of us to really make the proof stick. But if SE datamines their data they just might find them, and the clear sellers may even be blind to the RMT, but the RMT can easily make use of the clear sellers for their own benefit without them being any wiser.

Selling runs is perfectly acceptable if people are willing to pay for it. ....

There are many things that can be sold in game and in real life. Just because people are willing to pay, does NOT make it acceptable. Only those who are ethically challenged thinks it is OK without consider the subject matter. Clears should be obtained fair and square by persistence, patience, and learning by the player for themselves.

Do you walk up to a crafter and expect them to make whatever you want for free?

Actually there are many crafters that will help with melds and crafts for free. But they usually don't give way materials or items, yet I've even seen that happen. Nonetheless, crafted goods and gathered mats are sanctioned trade by SE, and market board was created to facilitate that. And the price for those items are not determined by the time put in to level, craft, gather etc. It is purely determined by the market conditions. And you can buy all the vanity you want, but you still won't get the Allagan, High Allagan, or Dreadwrym gear. Those are not meant to be obtainable by gil.

[Ellatrix]

padded room bubble ramblings

Gil is a mean to exchange goods and services in a mutually agreeable way.

You're basically saying anything at all that is exchanging a service for money is ethically wrong. Hi, please go outside and step into the place where the sun shines and then step inside a business.

Or better yet, go into your inn room in game and demand the aesthetician changes your hair for free. After all, that's paying gil for a service!

[NyarukoW]

..
You're basically saying anything at all that is exchanging a service for money is ethically wrong. ...

Way to go at making up completely nonsensical interpretations. See:

..
There are many things that can be sold in game and in real life. Just because people are willing to pay, does NOT make it acceptable....

Just because people are willing to pay does not make it ethical or unethical. You are ethically challenged, so you think anything and everything should be bought and sold with money. But civilized society has laws and regulation, just like games have rules, both clearly stated and unstated societal norms socially enforced, because having everyone freedoms protected by having order and stability is better than anarchy and chaos. It is only reasonable that civilized society should have rules that sort out contentions between conflicting interests, and not all trade and exchanges are acceptable if it is harmful to the society, in this case the game community.

BTW you've shown that you like to take nonsense extreme positions. Example:

...If DPS has to hold back, tank is bad...

It is a team game, people need to play together and adjust and adapt. Similarily, not everything should be up for trade and exchange. SE has actually has built that into the game and is basically forgotten and take for granted, considering how much gear is actually untradeable.

[Ophie-Mio]

The RMT and clear sellers are probably in cahoots, but of course if they are smart they will have some sort of gil laundering scheme so they do NOT get their important accounts banned, and it makes it all the harder to any of us to really make the proof stick. But if SE datamines their data they just might find them, and the clear sellers may even be blind to the RMT, but the RMT can easily make use of the clear sellers for their own benefit without them being any wiser.

...I...am just baffled at the amount of conspiracy theory here. Just baffled. It would be hilarious if I knew you were joking.

RMT and clear sellers are not in cahoots. RMT usually are individuals or actual businesses that do the same thing. They pump the game of gil. Clear sellers are raid groups that want to make gil.

Hell, my group last night just sold a run to someone needing Twintania. We saw them complaining about it and offered it and he took it. All for the wonderful price of 5 gil. (We were bored). We are not RMT and we are not in cahoots with them. You're just talking cray.

There are many things that can be sold in game and in real life. Just because people are willing to pay, does NOT make it acceptable. Only those who are ethically challenged thinks it is OK without consider the subject matter. Clears should be obtained fair and square by persistence, patience, and learning by the player for themselves.

Don't tell people how to enjoy their game time. I don't buy clears but if someone wants to do it then they can. Whatever they want to do is their right when they pay a monthly fee. I'm sorry but get off the high horse that you seem to love in these forums.

[NyarukoW]

...I...am just baffled at the amount of conspiracy theory here. ..

There is no conspiracy theory required. Fact is both clear sellers and RMT sellers are spamming you more than often enough to fill up your blacklist. You would have to be deliberately blind to not see how gil can be converted to real money and how that can be major motivating factor. There is old chinese saying, "all kinds of business exist, including those that may cause heads to roll, but there will never be one that loses money for very long"

.Don't tell people how to enjoy their game time. ... I'm sorry but get off the high horse that you seem to love in these forums.

Buy clears is not enjoying the game, it is bypassing it. Enjoying the game means enjoying wiping with friends, learning to solve the puzzle together, building friendships, etc. etc. And that high horse? I do NOT what you are talking about. I don't ride horses, and we have the right to protest clear sellers for their unethical and unhelpful behavior. If they got the time to sit on the PF and sell clears, they got time to go help a learning party.

[Ophie-Mio]

There is no conspiracy theory required. Fact is both clear sellers and RMT sellers are spamming you more than often enough to fill up your blacklist.

You said that they were in cahoots. If you're saying that they are based on how much they spam you, then FCs are in cahoots too. All of these things fill up my chat window and my blacklist.

Buy clears is not enjoying the game, it is bypassing it. Enjoying the game means enjoying wiping with friends, learning to solve the puzzle together, building friendships, etc. etc.

Once again, you're telling people how to enjoy their time and their game. Seems a bit preachy to me.

And that high horse? I do NOT what you are talking about. I don't ride horses, and we have the right to protest clear sellers for their unethical and unhelpful behavior. If they got the time to sit on the PF and sell clears, they got time to go help a learning party.

No, once again, preachy. You have the right to protest it but we have the right to tell you to get off the soap box too. And seriously, selling clears helps the people who want to buy them. They're willing and people who wanna sell it are willing. Win/Win. If you don't wanna buy your run, don't buy one. It's that simple. No need for all this preaching.

[Kazumac]

Buy clears is not enjoying the game, it is bypassing it. Enjoying the game means enjoying wiping with friends, learning to solve the puzzle together, building friendships, etc. etc.

I think we can all agree NyarukoW knows what's best for all of us and what we enjoy and desire in a game. Can you tell me more on how to live my life oh psychic one? What if I just want to craft all by my lonesome? Have I missed the point if the game despite it bringing me great joy to fill the marketplace full of goods with my name on it? Should I tell my FC member who loves taking in the scenery and fishing that he's not enjoying the game... Others having a high horse... Look in the mirror.

(Shoot I'm feeding the troll! But it's so fun watching them eat! Lol)

[NyarukoW]

...What if I just want to craft all by my lonesome? ..

No one said you can't do what you want when you are not hurting others. Go craft if it floats your boat.

... Seems a bit preachy to me. .. No need for all this preaching. ....

So what? No one tells you to listen to that preacher on campus who is always there at lunch time either. I like that they are putting in an earnest effort to help everyone. I do NOT go up to tell them to shut up even if I don't agree with them all the time.

... we have the right to tell you to get off the soap box too....

If no want to listen the do NOT have to. But obviously something about this simple message for players coming together and playing together helping each other is so threatening that you'd actually want to take away my right of free speech (a.k.a no soap box)? Seriously?