The cycle of disbanding that keep casuals from doing content

[Remilia_Nightfall]

I still don't understand what's so hard about finding a FC / static. Being "casual" does not mean you can't find or create a static made for casual players.

"Casual" does not necessarily mean "bad".

[Krr]

Regardless of the OP having a solution or not (I call attempting to form an LS an attempt at a solution more than anything - ) it goes to show that regardless, our community has serious problems when it comes to reaching out to newcomers or anyone who is 'behind the curve' of progression-based raiding.

Party finder culture is abominable on many servers where pub raiding is active - outright lying and listing a clear group as "no 100 myth", confusingly, gets you more players and thus more attempts than stating that you're going for a clear. Not a learning party - a clear party that doesn't have "farm" or "no 100 myth" in the name. On other servers, it's dead. In either case - get a static or go home.

Contrary to popular belief, finding or running "your own" static is not as easy as casting a spell on /r/recruitment or your server's forum that summons 7 other players that mesh with your group's needs and playstyle. You will spend hours in empty party finders trying to find people at 'your level', because people above 'your level' have no incentive - and in most cases negative incentive - to ever want to be around you. It's social classes in a video game where achievements and loot are class identifiers.

Are there ways around it? Absolutely, and the recent patch launch is frankly a great time to go about recruiting or looking for an FC that does raid-level content. But a 19-page thread of other players telling a newbie to bootstrap through content they cleared when it was hot, popular, and easy to find players for without a clue of the reality it entails nowadays is funny, sad, and a damn good indicator of the systemic problems in the game and the community it fosters alike.

This needs to change. And if you just read 'change' and thought 'nerfs to existing boss fights' in any way, you're part of the issue.

[Remilia_Nightfall]

things

There is no need to "reach out" to anyone.

There is still a huge amount of players who has yet to clear T5. There is only one relevant factor that stops them from forming up dedicated FCs and statics: the will to lead and organize things. The will to actually WORK towards something.

Instead of wasting time whining, people could do just like everyone else who is now raiding endgame content did: try to SOLVE the issues instead of waiting for others to do that.

Sure, organizing and leading statics and FCs is hard and troublesome and time consuming - yet SOMEONE has to do it, or no one will accomplish anything. Most of the people raiding endgame content started like that - creating statics and FCs for T1-T5.

Do it. Plenty of people to recruit out there.

This is the only "change" needed. Player initiative. Everything else is just noise.

[Tiggy]

This is the only "change" needed. Player initiative. Everything else is just noise.

Exactly. MMO's are what you make of them. If you sit around waiting for things to happen then you're going to do a lot of sitting around. Proactive players get the most done and make the most progress.

[Aldora]

The thing with MMO’s is that it requires a lot of investment of your time and effort to progress in the game. Everything you do in an MMO will take time and a lot of effort (depending on the type of content you are doing) to complete.

The MMO industry has changed a lot in the past 10 years. The people who have been playing games for the past decade have changed too. Some have gotten full time jobs and perhaps a family of their own, or they are new to industry all together. You can see a trend where we as players feel that we don’t have enough time to play the game, but still want to progress through end-game raids. You can also see trends where players like us want to feel that sense of gratification when getting a item you want or surpassing that brick wall in front of us/glass roof above us, but with less time or effort spend as we used to do 10 years ago (mainly because we have less time to spend in the game then we used to).

We want to spend our time as efficiently as possible in order to progress towards our (personal) goal. Be it clearing End Game content, getting that special item, etc.

A lot of people remember the days where we would stand in crowded city-states, shouting for members to form a party. Some of those people also remember the horror of waiting for hours before actually getting a party together...

The Duty Finder and the Party Finder are means to make that process faster or at least more bearable. The problem with that is, we tend to socialize less with the people living in the same world. Some even place a lot of stress on others by placing high expectations on the party, or are simply rude (because they can).

It’s like Krr said in the post above me:

Contrary to popular belief, finding or running "your own" static is not as easy as casting a spell on /r/recruitment or your server's forum that summons 7 other players that mesh with your group's needs and playstyle. You will spend hours in empty party finders trying to find people at 'your level', because people above 'your level' have no incentive - and in most cases negative incentive - to ever want to be around you.

It’s not like there aren’t any high level players that will join parties like that. But most of them would most likely have no real incentive to join learning parties or run low level content.

I can only talk from my own perspective. But, i tend to stick to my own FC, rather than scouting the PF if there are any people that need help. The main reason is that there is always someone who could use some help. Be it with the daily Expert Roulette, needing a tank for Aurum Vale so that they can level their class or need a hand with the Relic Reborn quest.

If not, then i have my own static with which i do Coil a few night per week or have other stuff i need to do myself (like doing the Main/Side Story quests, crafting, etc). Due to this, i don’t have a lot of time to spend on helping people i don’t know.

If i spot people in Mor Dhona or Coerthas shouting that they are looking for members for something like a Chimera or perhaps a Cape Westwind, sure i’ll join when i have time to spare. I’m all for helping people. But like i said, since i don’t have much time to spare, i would not be eager to join Coil or Extreme Primal Learning parties that might take an hour or even longer.

So, from that point of view. I believe that community should at least try to help out their fellow Eorzeans, but I think other people should also respect that not everyone has time to help out or feels like helping out.

It works both ways.

I’ll use the following quote from Tiggy, since that’s basically what this topic is about.

MMO's are what you make of them. If you sit around waiting for things to happen then you're going to do a lot of sitting around. Proactive players get the most done and make the most progress.

As mentioned before, the Duty Finder and Party Finder are means to gather people to form parties and tackle content together, without having the need to have a lot of friends or a Linkshell/Company to help out.

But, at the same time i would also like stress out that there are benefits when it comes to joining a Linkshell/Company when it comes to gathering people to form parties. Because, like i said above, people like me (who love to help other out) tend to help out their members faster than “complete strangers”.

You just need to find a Linkshell/Company that best suits your needs as a player.

So, my advice: Take a look around your Worlds section on the forum and see if you can find a Linkshell/Company that is looking for members and are willing to help. You can also start a new thread, saying that you are looking for people to tackle Coil with. Players who are in the same situation as you will be able to reach you there.

You can also set your status to “Looking for party/members” and add some text to your Search Info that you are looking for people to do Coil with.

Add all of those things together and it shouldn’t be too hard to find like minded people to do content with.

[NyarukoW]

I still don't understand what's so hard about finding a FC / static. ....

Well are have you walked in the OP's shoes? Finding a FC is easy, finding static that does T6 and up, that is often much harder than Raffy, Melusine, Avatar, and Nael combined. Why else are there threads like this one, or this: http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/commen...ality_is_very/

Forming a static is not easy, keeping a static together is also not easy. Getting an LS together is only a small first step and YMMV. I've seen statics come and go. But what is fairly consistent is that you see learning PFs not filling for hours, and clear sellers advertising 24/7. The correlation implied by that data points strongly to people who are ethically challenged and an attitude of contempt and disdain for the newbies, and newer players, while gladly taking their gil.

Just what is so wrong to ask that people look out for one another instead of looking to exploit them? What is so wrong to as that people be more inclusive. Sure everyone's time is limited, but why not help instead of posting rage against the newer players.

[Ellatrix]

you see learning PFs not filling for hours, and clear sellers advertising 24/7

I don't see any merc runs going on and there's a Shiva learning party that's sitting at 6/7 right now that has been up for 9 minutes. There's also one begging for a mog ex clear which is understandably not filling because really, who wants to join a PF called "need clear". Bunch of other things in PF too.

Something something where apparently mercs are the cause of everything that's bad in everything. Stay in your bubble, since you might have a breakdown if you ever get out of it. You also continuously ignore the main method vets help newer players: posting guides so that they don't have to spend time doing things that don't work or figure out how something works.

[Ellatrix]

You also continuously ignore the main method vets help newer players: posting guides so that they don't have to spend time doing things that don't work or figure out how something works.

Let me extract it for you.

Also no, a party that says only "need clear :3" is not someone who deserves to be carried to a clear just because they put up a PF. By that same logic, if I made a PF to farm T4 that said "all loot is locked to me for craft/desynth" I deserve to have 7 people be my slaves until such a time that I choose to disband the party.

[NyarukoW]

.. posting guides ...

I thank Mr. Happy for posting guides. Where are your guides? As far as I know Mr. Happy is doing all the work for you.

.
.. "need clear :3" is not someone who deserves to be carried ..

So much false assumptions. Sure they need a clear, but that is does not equal need carry. Actually it means for those that also need a clear can join them and everyone benefits together. And they are in no ways looking for "7 people be my slaves until such a time that I choose to disband the party"

So "need clear" is no way equal or equivalent to "all loot is locked to me for craft/desynth".

[Remilia_Nightfall]

...

Yes, I walked in the OP's shoes. And I know that forming and managing a static is not easy, since I've been doing that personally since day one. People come and go, people grab their loot and say "FU" to other members, I've been there, I've seen that, I know how hard it is to find people and keep them together.

Still, it's doable. It's not easy, but it's doable. Just like T9.

Point is, some people enjoy working long and hard to accomplish something. It's only natural that they dislike players who think they can just jump in and get easy kills just because "OMG empathy". It's not how it works.

You can't find a static? Create one. Will it be hard? Yes. So what?