[dev1033] Class name changes -> Specialization/Talent Trees Into Classic FF Classes

[Kurokikaze]

I agree. That why in Solracht's compromise system, I believe that Rank 50 Conjurer will still have their Raise ability as a Level 1 WHM, RDM, or BLM.

Naturally, we would want the White Mage to have bonuses increasing Raise's effectiveness or reduced MP cost for it, the Black Mage to have increased costs and effectiveness penalties, and the Red Mage to have neither bonus nor penalty for using the Raise that the Rank 50 Conjurer earned.

You missed the point entirely.

[Sorel]

You missed the point entirely.

I guess I did. I apologize for my ignorance. Can you please lay out what I am missing?

[Elcura]

I guess I did. I apologize for my ignorance. Can you please lay out what I am missing?

It's to not start from scratch if you have a level 50 job because no one is using the basic jobs as they are anymore.

[Kurokikaze]

I guess I did. I apologize for my ignorance. Can you please lay out what I am missing?

Theres more than just classes to this post.

I'm reorganizing spells and splitting them across the specs in a way that make sense so that the base class only has generic skills that can be used cross-class. Raise is not a generic skill, that is a WHM ability and it would be in that spec.

Now let's say they implement this that way some of us are envisioning; again - what are you going to do with players that have classes at 50 in future balancing for content is being based off the fact that every player will be playing as a particular spec.

Your proposal is to make them start over from scratch pretty much.

[Sorel]

Theres more than just classes to this post.

I'm reorganizing spells and splitting them across the specs in a way that make sense so that the base class only has generic skills that can be used cross-class. Raise is not a generic skill, that is a WHM ability and it would be in that spec.

Now let's say they implement this that way some of us are envisioning; again - what are you going to do with players that have classes at 50 in future balancing for content is being based off the fact that every player will be playing as a particular spec.

Your proposal is to make them start over from scratch pretty much.

Well I have not really proposed anything to be honest. But I think I get what you are saying. My understanding is crude, so please correct me when I make a mistake.

• Rebuild the Armory System classes so that abilities like Raise, Chainspell, Cover, etc ... are removed from them.
• Add the ability for classes to become Jobs. Various jobs will have the abilities that were removed.
• Player wiill start at the same level job as their rank in their Armory Class.

So if I'm a Rank 40 Conjurer right now. And SE adopts the change being proposed. The next day, I will no longer have Chainspell, Raise, or Fastcast. But I will be able to become a Red Mage 40 with Fastcast and Chainspell, or a White Mage 40 with Raise.

Will I have the option to be both, and switch at will?

[Kurokikaze]

Well I have not really proposed anything to be honest. But I think I get what you are saying. My understanding is crude, so please correct me when I make a mistake.

• Rebuild the Armory System classes so that abilities like Raise, Chainspell, Cover, etc ... are removed from them.
• Add the ability for classes to become Jobs. Various jobs will have the abilities that were removed.
• Player wiill start at the same level job as their rank in their Armory Class.

So if I'm a Rank 40 Conjurer right now. And SE adopts the change being proposed. The next day, I will no longer have Chainspell, Raise, or Fastcast. But I will be able to become a Red Mage 40 with Fastcast and Chainspell, or a White Mage 40 with Raise.

Will I have the option to be both, and switch at will?

Yes and yes. Er not both at once obviously but switch at will yes.

[solracht]

So if I'm a Rank 40 Conjurer right now. And SE adopts the change being proposed. The next day, I will no longer have Chainspell, Raise, or Fastcast. But I will be able to become a Red Mage 40 with Fastcast and Chainspell, or a White Mage 40 with Raise.

Will I have the option to be both, and switch at will?

That's exactly it, but you'd technically still be a Conjurer in either case. The difference being whether you're a Conjurer specced into Red Mage, or Conjurer specced into White mage. Conjurer still exists, however.

You would be able to be both to an extent - if they allowed things such as dual-specs in WoW, or soul templates in Rift. With the press of a button, you could switch between your RDM build, or your WHM build. Or between two RDM builds, possibly.

[solracht]

I guess I did. I apologize for my ignorance. Can you please lay out what I am missing?

Since you quoted my system, I'll reply too. The compromise system doesn't have jobs starting at level 1. It has specs as explained in Kuro's main post.

Two things could happen with things like Raise: either it's removed from conjurer's base line of skills an added to the WHM/RDM/etc trees, or it's left as it is but the WHM/RDM trees boost them.

I'm not against either, but there wouldn't be a level 1 WHM/RDM/BLM casting Raise if you had a rank 50 conjurer, regardless, because at rank 50, after the changes, you'd have enough job/talent points to max out WHM/RDM/BLM right away (assuming job/talent points are assigned simply for ranking up like in other games such as WoW, Rift, etc).

More on this: Something that was being discussed was whether job points would be awarded simply for ranking up the class, or if you would have to do anything else to obtain them.

Some people are against being able to instantly switch to a max-specced DRK after leveling as PLD for your entire Gladiator career, and some are fine with that. I don't care about which approach is taken.

However if you have to do something to gain job points, it can't be too annoying - certainly nothing of the scale of ranking a class to 50.