armory system useless? Mythology Cap

[Leadros]

I know casual gamers are where the money is, but please don't forget us old-school MMO-ers that enjoy progression!

I dont think so.
Swtor and GW2 both failed in the part that they didnt have any hard endgame for months and months on.
People think Casuals matter more, but its atleast 50/50. you have to realize that there is no reason for a "hardcore" to complain when something might be hard.

[Ri_ri]

[*]Casual players are likely to lose motivation to play.

Sorry mister Yoshida, but you're doing all the casuals a huge disservice here. Most of us don't care only about gear - We want to play the dungeons.

Don't handle us the level 90 gear while you leave the most important dungeon in the game to the few who can commit to schedules.

[lBurnquist]

And I keep loving this game even more!

[Rumpelstiltzkin]

I have not played since before I payed for another month, I don't like the direction that has been taken with ARR considering what I think it could have been. HOWEVER I have to give it to Yoshida, I think he does a great job at explaining his reasoning and although I might not agree with everything I appreciate that. I really think SE has done a great job with ARR even though like I said the game is not for me.

[Seig345]

Not sure how you're 'defeating' the system when they give us a subscription option to have 8 character slots per server... If you really want to start over and go through the whole story again just to get another 300 myth tomes a week, have at it.

Sure, you can ride the fate train to 50 without touching the story, but on a new character, you don't get teleport (I don't think you even start off with Return), GC's (and therefore the ability to ride a mount, including 'unlocked' ones your character might start off with due to legacy or CE), retainers, airship, etc, until you play at least part way through the story. Pretty sure that throws out any of the primal fates as well, not sure if it would stop you from jumping into WP/AK so you can work on darklight though.

[Casper]

While the explication of Yoshi-P are nice and answer a number of things, they do nothing regarding two major problems affecting a huge number of players:

1) With current cap limits, you can't gear several jobs at once. While i get the motivation for the caps for a given job/role (prevent powerleveling to the extreme), it is still extremely detrimental to the game that one can not gear several job at once. The whole armory system is supposed to allow you to switch from one job to another in different dungeons/raids if oyu desire/it is needed for your comp. Here, you can NOT, at least in coil, as you have all but your main job locked at 70 (or all of them are gimped compared to the people you play with and focus on a single job). Why have a armory system in the first place ?

2) People that have cleared BC will have to wait 4 more months before getting a new challenge. The part about "go check pvp" is borderline insulting -- i could not care less about pvp, and i'm pretty sure a number of endgame raider feel the same. When i want pvp i go play starcraft, lol, dota, or a fps. I play mmo for the pve. Even though i don't have cleared coil yet, i feel the fact that we won't have anything harder to look forward to for 4 months distressing -- can't imagine what it's like for top FC of each server. And before you say that casual matters more, i beg you to reconsider. Casual and hardcore always have had a symbiosic relationship in online games. Most of the time one does not exist without the other, and if all the players that have cleared coil or are about to before 2.1 were to leave the game at once, i am pretty sure the net impact would be way beyond just these players.

Basically the "please look forward to pvp" line was a confirmation that no challenge is coming in 2.1, which is a recipe for disaster. Also, you don't have to clear coil to have >80 average ilvl by 2.1 (i mean if you clear turn 1 and 2 everyweek with your fc it is plenty enough), so you can expect to faceroll all new content the first week (because honestly, even for titan that gather so many complaints, once you get way overgeared you can steamroll him even if half your team are monkeys).

[mr_wazzabi]

Best thing I can think of is making the cap and tomes class locked. So if you max tomes as a paladin you can switch to monk to get tomes for your monk class. Of course with this they would have to implement a filter when buying gear as well is glad/pad can only buy glad/pal gear and cannot buy conj/whm gear that way it still puts a pace on how fast you can gear up each class and you can't have players in full AF2 gear in a couple of days by buying pal gear with tomes collected on a Monk.

Bad idea. I use my warrior to grind tomes for my monk for the faster queue times and shorter pickup from shouts. It takes forever to find groups as a dps sometimes since there's too damn many. If you class lock tomes then it'll take more than double the time to gear up dps. I've waited for 3 hours in queue in the df before, it's not fun

[YuriRamona]

One unique quality of MMORPGs is that, depending on how much time they have to play, a disparity between players can easily emerge. For example, let's say player A plays two hours per day, and player B plays five hours per day. After a week, there's a difference of 21 hours, after five weeks a difference of 105 hours, and after ten weeks a difference of 210 hours. MMORPGs are designed to be played over a long period of time, and as such, this gap between players will only increase as time goes on. This inevitably leads to several problems:
It becomes difficult for new players to join.
Casual players are likely to lose motivation to play.
The community is likely to become fragmented.

A weekly reset on the tomestone cap only partially addresses this. More casual players (or dedicated players under extenuating circumstances) will arrive at the endgame and will forever be behind players who reached endgame earlier. While the progress of dedicated players is limited, the stratification/gap between dedicated players and casual players will always be present.

Players should each have a capped allotment of mythology tomestomes assigned to them that grows every week by 300/450 starting from the first week of release.

With this system, a player that reaches level 50 for the first time tomorrow has the chance to gather the thousands of mythology tomestones that their friends or peers have already obtained over the course of the last few months.

Dedicated players aren't really harmed by this system; they were still the first to enjoy the benefits of accessing higher level content such as the Binding Coil and obtain gear earlier. And, if anything, having casual players be able to reach dedicated players' level of achievement means there are more opportunities to make friends and meet new players.

This is dangerous to fostering a healthy endgame community.

As it stands, it is quite difficult to ask dedicated players who have nearly completed a set of item level 90 equipment for a job to party up with an equally eager player who, due to the weekly cap, can only obtain, at best, one item level 90 weapon when they've reached level 50. By keeping dedicated players permanently ahead and casual players behind, there is little opportunity of mixing the two groups and generating new friendships. Even the most eager casual player must wait months to reach the level of achievement of a dedicated player - and by that point, they will once again be months ahead.

This system also disincentivizes and punishes casual players for playing through mythology tomestone-granting dungeons repeatedly. While dedicated players have dozens, if not hundreds, of completions through these dungeons and encounters along their course of obtaining mythology tomestones every week, casual players will, often, only be rewarded lesser tomestones of philosophy for completing this content. They are discouraged from reaching the same level of mastery and understanding as dedicated players. This translates to an ever-widening gap in skill and experience in endgame content.

An accumulating personal allotment is simply an extension of the ideals and tenets of the rested EXP system and the levequest allotment system. Players who have less time for the game should be encouraged and supported in their efforts to catch up, even at the highest level of endgame.

[Velhart]

1) With current cap limits, you can't gear several jobs at once. While i get the motivation for the caps for a given job/role (prevent powerleveling to the extreme), it is still extremely detrimental to the game that one can not gear several job at once. The whole armory system is supposed to allow you to switch from one job to another in different dungeons/raids if oyu desire/it is needed for your comp. Here, you can NOT, at least in coil, as you have all but your main job locked at 70 (or all of them are gimped compared to the people you play with and focus on a single job). Why have a armory system in the first place ?

You don't have to use mythology tokens to gear other jobs. Having the best gear for every job end game is unbalanced and ill-thought and has more negative aspects than any positive. Using Darklight and crafted gear is more than capable of at least taking down Turn 1-4, which you can farm for other gear on if that is how your FC rolls. Just because the armory system gives the option of letting you play multiple class/job's doesn't mean the developers had the intent of having you play each one. Yoshida has been quite vocal on encouraging you to focus on a main job and using the armory system to further improve on it. You really only look at what is on the outside of the box with the armory system. The current system is fine.

[Arkista]

Bad idea. I use my warrior to grind tomes for my monk for the faster queue times and shorter pickup from shouts. It takes forever to find groups as a dps sometimes since there's too damn many. If you class lock tomes then it'll take more than double the time to gear up dps. I've waited for 3 hours in queue in the df before, it's not fun

Class lock for myth caps would suck for that reason alone. I leveled up PLD to do my weekly runs cause I got tired of waiting 45mins+ on my MNK ( and I've tried all different hours/days and still wait forever). Going as a tank I get like 1 sec DF times. So I'm against Changing Tomes to Jobs, We are getting a 150 cap increase in 2.1 so that's fine with me.