A Warrior Tanking Compendium?

[Hachiko]

The other thing about SE combo is that it's a 33% increase on healing returned via Inner Beast and Bloodbath. That is very significant, and for that reason alone it should be kept up.

Fracture doesn't have the same benefit. It doesn't increase your survivability. It doesn't increase your enmity. And the damage gained is minimal. Yes, it's only 1 GCD every 30 seconds, but it's also only a gain of about 70-90 potency every 30 seconds.

To put this in perspective, Let's say you're doing the alternating rotation (BB -> SE -> BB -> SE) which is imo best for using Fracture and probably best in terms of DPS.

You've got 4 full combos in 30 seconds. One Butcher's Block combo is 630 potency. One Maim combo is 610. So in those 30 seconds you're putting out 2480 potency worth of attacks. The "Average" potency of one of the global cooldowns is ~206.

Adding fracture in swaps one of those "average" globals for a 300 potency global every 30 seconds. It's a gain, but it's only a gain of 94 potency. When you're talking about 2480 potency over the time period, adding an additional 94 doesn't make a huge difference. We're talking something like a 3.7% increase in DPS.

Yes, it's an increase in DPS. But it's not an amazing increase.

It also ignores the fact that it's a "costly" ability to monitor, mentally. You have to track the duration on the mob, you have to ensure you're top on threat by a good margin. You have to (or should) be sure you have 5 wrath stacks. And you have to only use it in between full combos. For this reason, it should probably only be used in "comfortable" situations, such as when you aren't taking heavy damage, or you aren't having to fight for threat. (though my biggest threat competitors seem to be white mages).

Butcher's Block Combo: (300+1500+4300)x3 = 18300 (813 TPS)

Butcher's Block Combo With Storm's Eye: 300+680+1220 + ((390+1950+5590)x2) = 18060 (803 TPS)

I don't know if this is right. I'm pretty sure Storm's Eye will wear off before the 2nd butchers block hits, if you go SE -> BB -> BB -> SE -> BB -> BB as your rotation. But I could be wrong on the timing of the SE debuff going up.

[Pixelshader]

The other thing about SE combo is that it's a 33% increase on healing returned via Inner Beast and Bloodbath. That is very significant, and for that reason alone it should be kept up.

Fracture doesn't have the same benefit. It doesn't increase your survivability. It doesn't increase your enmity. And the damage gained is minimal. Yes, it's only 1 GCD every 30 seconds, but it's also only a gain of about 70-90 potency every 30 seconds.

To put this in perspective, Let's say you're doing the alternating rotation (BB -> SE -> BB -> SE) which is imo best for using Fracture and probably best in terms of DPS.

You've got 4 full combos in 30 seconds. One Butcher's Block combo is 630 potency. One Maim combo is 610. So in those 30 seconds you're putting out 2480 potency worth of attacks. The "Average" potency of one of the global cooldowns is ~206.

Adding fracture in swaps one of those "average" globals for a 300 potency global every 30 seconds. It's a gain, but it's only a gain of 94 potency. When you're talking about 2480 potency over the time period, adding an additional 94 doesn't make a huge difference. We're talking something like a 3.7% increase in DPS.

Yes, it's an increase in DPS. But it's not an amazing increase.

It also ignores the fact that it's a "costly" ability to monitor, mentally. You have to track the duration on the mob, you have to ensure you're top on threat by a good margin. You have to (or should) be sure you have 5 wrath stacks. And you have to only use it in between full combos. For this reason, it should probably only be used in "comfortable" situations, such as when you aren't taking heavy damage, or you aren't having to fight for threat. (though my biggest threat competitors seem to be white mages).



I don't know if this is right. I'm pretty sure Storm's Eye will wear off before the 2nd butchers block hits, if you go SE -> BB -> BB -> SE -> BB -> BB as your rotation. But I could be wrong on the timing of the SE debuff going up.

It will last with a second to spare. Apparently the buff is placed after the animation is over and I landed the 2nd butchers block with 1 second on the target. It's very possible that both the animation and the debuff icon are false positives. I would have to check logs which I am not going to do haha.

As for fracture, I will not recommend putting it up simply because no modifiers and as you said its yet another item adding overhead to the player.

[Kitru]

Adding fracture in swaps one of those "average" globals for a 300 potency global every 30 seconds. It's a gain, but it's only a gain of 94 potency. When you're talking about 2480 potency over the time period, adding an additional 94 doesn't make a huge difference. We're talking something like a 3.7% increase in DPS.

Fracture isn't a 300 potency GCD. It's 400: 100 for the baseline hit and 15 ticks (.5/sec for 30 secs) of 20 potency each. That's 400 Potency. Going from ~2500 to ~2700 potency is an 8% increase in total DPS, which isn't anything to sneeze at.

A *lot* of people underestimate how powerful Fracture is. Even as an additional, it's a 280 potency attack (100 + 20 * (18 / 2)) that doesn't require any wind up. That's a *damned* good attack to have. Arguably, it's the best additional in the entire game.

[Hachiko]

Fracture isn't a 300 potency GCD. It's 400: 100 for the baseline hit and 15 ticks (.5/sec for 30 secs) of 20 potency each. That's 400 Potency. Going from ~2500 to ~2700 potency is an 8% increase in total DPS, which isn't anything to sneeze at.

A *lot* of people underestimate how powerful Fracture is. Even as an additional, it's a 280 potency attack (100 + 20 * (18 / 2)) that doesn't require any wind up. That's a *damned* good attack to have. Arguably, it's the best additional in the entire game.

I'm almost 100 % positive DoT skills tick every 3 seconds, plus I just tested it and they do tick every 3 seconds. So 30 second duration = 10 ticks, not 15.

[TheAngryEwok]

Has anyone really found out what works best for Warriors, stat wise yet? I've read so many mixed things about what you should spec your 30 points into.

[Aleisterz]

Like TheAngryEwok said.. I'd like to ask the same thing, where do you think points should go? I myself have tried the 30 points into strength for a bit before today switching to 30 points into vitality.. and I'll be testing that out... I'm concerned with having such a larger vitality HP pool and lacking strength that I may face some of the things HiirNoivl was mentioning and end up being more squishy of a tank.
My main concern is the tanking (I do tanking just fine but I am always looking to improve) and not dps as HiirNoivl said.. We are tanks but we are tanks that tank by smashing the foe's face inside out which makes me wonder how the attribute points should be place and how accessories should be handle? Feel free to direct me to another thread, I just couldn't find a thread that had what I was looking for and felt that this didn't need its very own thread.

[Kiteless]

I'm almost 100 % positive DoT skills tick every 3 seconds, plus I just tested it and they do tick every 3 seconds. So 30 second duration = 10 ticks, not 15.

Yep, one tick every 3 seconds, based on the server's clock, not on any independent timers. This means that, depending on when you actually activated the skill (essentially entirely based on luck), you can lose a tick due to the DoT wearing off before the server decides to put the final tick of damage in.

[HiirNoivl]

I tested 15/15 Stat Allocation and my Self heals and DPS were good but not great...

I'm currently working with 20/10 Str/Vit Stat Allocation with Vit accessories.

I still have more HP than a PLD, but it was scary at first, because I'm missing about 1000 HP that I had before (I went from about 7700 with Defiance to 6700 with defiance). I have to Self Heal a lot more, but at the same time, my self heals are a lot bigger.

And what's more amazing is that I'm actually getting healed less. When I had 8k HP all the time, though I always mentioned to my resident WHMs that they didn't need to cure that much, what happened was that the urge to fill my bar overwrote the actual need to fill my bar and led to wasted curing. And then my inability to self-heal added to the emergency level when I actually did need curing.

My greater and frequent self cures as well as my lower Max HP have benefitted the mages, even though they still say that they cure me more than a PLD still. But the big difference is in the fights. AK runs now hover between 20-25 minutes. Trash pulls still are my weakness but the bosses just don't stand a chance with the Demon Wall dying at Add spawn and the Psychflayer dying on Big Golem Spawn, and the Lizard Thing Dying before the 3rd Imminent Disaster. The fights go a lot faster because my efforts at Self-healing needs encourage me to DPS as much as possible, using Berserk, Second Wind, Internal Release, and Unchained in different combos with Bloodbath and Inner Beast, which is the biggest attack of a melee DD outside of a combo.

Edit: Adding here that I'm still getting a feel for things with my new stats. Enmity is great. I can usually grab good amounts of hate on group. But I get beaten so badly when pulling groups. Bosses and single targets are just fine but those groups of adds, like 3 Sleeping Vordi-whatsits in AK, knocking on me at the same time, really put me in the danger zone and using my cool downs. So what I'm forced to do is Flash and Overpower once and then start working on a single mob and just plain killing it, then using Inner Beast on another mob that I'm about to lose hate on. Inner Beast will cure me back up and get me a good chunk of hate.

So it plays a lot differently than I was doing before. No more mob cycling. Just kill all the things.

[mcfuzzi]

So it plays a lot differently than I was doing before. No more mob cycling. Just kill all the things.

That's what i was hoping war would turn into. I am starting to feel pretty bad about leveling war, I love the class, but I don't want to be a drain on other people. I like to tank, but I also want to make sure that I am not hindering everyone else's game, I don't want other to take me out of pity, or hurt their game play just so I can be a war.

[TheAngryEwok]

Good to see people trying to work this out. And I agree, I love being a Warrior, but I don't want to be the one hindering a group just because this is the tank that I wanted to play. I mean I can always level up Gladiator and unlock Paladin but it will take even longer to do.