Global Alpha Test Start Date

[SkyeWindbinder]

When you do his kind of job, you take the good with the bad. He has to face criticism, but also a lot of praise. It's not all that bad.

Again, I already know this. But even Yoshi is human. I'm sure the whining can at least get to be annoying. But as I said, he does have a lot of patience. And as you said, it's really not always bad.

If you weren't intent on calling people "crybabies", "whiny" and all that, without knowing them or their motives, I wouldn't have chided you. Maybe you didn't notice that your choice of words was confrontational to begin with.

And being confrontational against people that are already discontent does nothing else than making the situation worse. It does SE or Yoshi no favors when they try to douse the flames and those that think they are on their side throw more fuel on them.

The fact that I made my statement against people who's motives are more than clear when they're whining tells me that you obviously are the one who doesn't understand motives. And you're quick to jump the gun, which can land you with egg on you face really fast. People whining about not getting an alpha invite and how they should have one because they have been long-time subscribers of FF14 have motives that are not only transparent, but they literally STATED THEIR MOTIVES right there!! lol So really, I have no idea what you are even trying to get across.

It's THOSE types of people that I was speaking of. The entitled whiners who cry about not getting an alpha invite for reasons that make sense only to them in their little world. And I'm not trying to help Yoshi or anyone else. I'm merely stating how annoying those kinds of people are with their consistent QQing. And you got ticked off real quick. Which you really shouldn't have, unless... you're one of said people...

The problem isn't just that people didn't get access to the Alpha. I couldn't care the less about that.
It's that people that had active accounts got passed in favor of people that didn't, while the form clearly stated in all available languages that only those with an active account were eligible.

And THOSE posts I have absolutely no problem with whatsoever. Legit concerns, yeah, I can get behind those. It's complainers, whiners, and QQers who are simply butthurt they didn't get into alpha that are getting sickeningly repetitive.

This is a serious lapse in communication, and people that are discontent about it have a degree of justification in that. It's also the kind of thing the press LOVES to cover, if given the chance. An off-hand accusation of false publicity is great to drive the controversy and the hits on websites.

Again, you are making it out to be more serious that it really is, lol. It's only really that serious to people who are merely angry that they didn't get into alpha. The worst that happened is that a few people didn't get in to test, which includes me, by the way. And again, sites are going to trash FFXIV, no matter what. Yoshi sneezing the wrong way will bring about harsh criticism for this game. So, really, people not getting into alpha is just getting stretched out of proportion.

The fact that they already do it isn't really a good reason to provide them with more ammo, isn't it?

Actually, if you're going to make a game, you can't tread on eggshells about what a few reviewers might say. Especially sine you know they're waiting to trash the game anyway. These people already have their ammo. They're loaded, and ready to shoot. All Yoshi and his team can do is do what they plan to with the game, how they plan to do it.

[Shougun]

Actually, if you're going to make a game, you can't tread on eggshells about what a few reviewers might say. Especially sine you know they're waiting to trash the game anyway. These people already have their ammo. They're loaded, and ready to shoot. All Yoshi and his team can do is do what they plan to with the game, how they plan to do it.

I'm not in the game review industry (actually you are talking to someone who is.. *pokes Abriael*) but I highly doubt they purposely attempt to trash games. Having read a lot of reviews they more often then not give games better credits they they deserve (opinion). That isnt to say a game never gets a bad review and you thought it was excellent but that makes sense because of course its still opinion.. But game review sites attempt to capture the essence and importantly what their audience will find useful reading.

[SkyeWindbinder]

I'm not in the game review industry (actually you are talking to someone who is.. *pokes Abriael*) but I highly doubt they purposely attempt to trash games. Having read a lot of reviews they more often then not give games better credits they they deserve (opinion). That isnt to say a game gets a bad review and you loved it because of course its still opinion but again.. game review sites attempt to capture the essence and importantly what their audience will find useful reading.

Perhaps,vbut I have read more than my fair share of highly questionable reviews by some of these reviewer sites (cough, IGN, cough). And it's cool that Abriel is into that kind of profession, but he seems to have hair-trigger judgment that can be hazardous in his line of work. lol

[Abriael]

I'm not in the game review industry (actually you are talking to someone who is.. *pokes Abriael*) but I highly doubt they purposely attempt to trash games. Having read a lot of reviews they more often then not give games better credits they they deserve (opinion). That isnt to say a game never gets a bad review and you thought it was excellent but that makes sense because of course its still opinion.. But game review sites attempt to capture the essence and importantly what their audience will find useful reading.

Oh, some do, believe me. No one that I would bear working with, of course (if any of my writers did something of the sort in any way that I could detect, I'd have a serious talk with them and the rest of the editorial team, and it could easily lead to termination), but I could name a large number of people that openly think that Square Enix deserves a "lesson", and that spare no chance in trying to administer it.

of course Square Enix isn't alone there. Electronic Arts is another good example. Many journos, even highly respected ones, have this warped idea that they're the vigilantes of the industry, and they need to "punish" the evil corporation of their choice with their almighty pen, instead of dedicating themselves to actual reporting.

Of course there are a whole lot of fair, intelligent and relatively unbiased (relatively because absolute lack of bias doesn't exist in any form of journalism. Anyone that tells you he's unbiased lies, and he knows it) ones, but if you look attentively, you'll easily be able to spot the rotten apples.

[Abriael]

The fact that I made my statement against people who's motives are more than clear when they're whining tells me that you obviously are the one who doesn't understand motives.

Quite the contrary. Having been in basically every major MMORPG beta since Ultima Online (and many minor ones), I understand people's motives very well. They're hardly as easy to identify and as black and white as you believe.

Some people are just butthurt. Some people are disappointed because they genuinely want to contribute to the development of the game, some people simply air their frustration not because they have some kind of grudge or because they feel entitled, but because as part of a community, they think in a rather naive way that other people will express their support instead of shooting them down. There are a lot of different motives and a lot of shades of grey.

People whining about not getting an alpha invite and how they should have one because they have been long-time subscribers of FF14 have motives that are not only transparent, but they literally STATED THEIR MOTIVES right there!! lol So really, I have no idea what you are even trying to get across.

Nope. That isn't stating a motive. That's stating a belief. And that belief has been created by Square Enix themselves, as the fact that active subscribers were the only ones eligible to the alpha was clearly stated in the application form. When a developer tells paying customers A and then does B, it's not unjustified for the paying customer to be disappointed and voice that disappointment.

And you got ticked off real quick. Which you really shouldn't have, unless... you're one of said people...

See what I mean, you're doing it again. You're second guessing my motives without knowing anything about me.

I got ticked off because I know that a certain amount of disappointment is quite justified in this situation, given the communication blunder, and I find people so ready to jump to the throat of people that are already (rightfully) disappointed rather distasteful.

It happens with every testing. People are always very ready to attack those that are already disappointed, making everyone's disappointment worse. It's bad and it really paints the community in a sad light.

And THOSE posts I have absolutely no problem with whatsoever. Legit concerns, yeah, I can get behind those. It's complainers, whiners, and QQers who are simply butthurt they didn't get into alpha that are getting sickeningly repetitive.

I'm sure there are people that are just "butthurt", but I don't know their percentage, nor you do. So I don't necessarily assume that everyone that complains belongs to that group like many here are doing, nor I go ahead and second guess their motives.

Again, you are making it out to be more serious that it really is, lol. It's only really that serious to people who are merely angry that they didn't get into alpha. The worst that happened is that a few people didn't get in to test, which includes me, by the way.

Nope. It's serious to anyone that knows that a company giving their customers wrong information often can lead to serious issues.

[quioe]And again, sites are going to trash FFXIV, no matter what. Yoshi sneezing the wrong way will bring about harsh criticism for this game. So, really, people not getting into alpha is just getting stretched out of proportion.[/quote]

Actually, if you're going to make a game, you can't tread on eggshells about what a few reviewers might say. Especially sine you know they're waiting to trash the game anyway. These people already have their ammo. They're loaded, and ready to shoot. All Yoshi and his team can do is do what they plan to with the game, how they plan to do it.

When you have a loaded rifle pointed at your face, encouraging the killer to shoot isn't exactly a sensible course of action.

[SkyeWindbinder]

Quite the contrary. Having been in basically every major MMORPG beta since Ultima Online (and many minor ones), I understand people's motives very well. They're hardly as easy to identify and as black and white as you believe.

Some people are just butthurt. Some people are disappointed because they genuinely want to contribute to the development of the game, some people simply air their frustration not because they have some kind of grudge or because they feel entitled, but because as part of a community, they think in a rather naive way that other people will express their support instead of shooting them down. There are a lot of different motives and a lot of shades of grey.

I've been there in nearly every major release of mmos as well. I'm not exactly a spring chicken myself, lol. And I'm very good at understanding people's motives myself. Many are not black and white, in fact it's rare to find some that are. But I'm good with people, and can read between the lines. I've always been good at picking apart people's motives and reasons. It's a gift of mine. Some are disappointed because they wanted to participate in testing the game, many are also disappointed because they don't get an early peek at the game. And I can tell with some observation which is which.

Nope. That isn't stating a motive. That's stating a belief. And that belief has been created by Square Enix themselves, as the fact that active subscribers were the only ones eligible to the alpha was clearly stated in the application form. When a developer tells paying customers A and then does B, it's not unjustified for the paying customer to be disappointed and voice that disappointment.

Beliefs create motives. People who believe that they are entitles to alpha simply because they have been there playing FF14 long before a lot of others have that belief. It motivates them to whine and cry like babies when they're not selected. And again, people disappointed that they didn't get in for the right reasons, I have no problem with. People who think their time playing the game before ARR should get them early access to alpha before those who haven't played as long, that's annoying. And stupid. And it's repeated so very many times.

See what I mean, you're doing it again. You're second guessing my motives without knowing anything about me.

Not at all. I merelt stated that you jumped the gun in your reply, not knowing which kind of people I was referring to. Which you did. OR, you are one of the people I was referring to. n which case, your anger would be predictable.

I got ticked off because I know that a certain amount of disappointment is quite justified in this situation, given the communication blunder, and I find people so ready to jump to the throat of people that are already (rightfully) disappointed rather distasteful.

First of all, getting ticked off was actually quite unnecessary. Predictable, if you're one of the people whining for the wrong reasons, but unnecessary. And proof you took things a bit too seriously. Secondly, I didn't jump down anyone's throat. I merely stated that people whining that they should get into alpha for reasons they themselves worked out in their heads and opinions are just annoying. You took it the wrong way by thinking I stated that anyone who had any kind of concerns whatsoever over how alpha was handled were whiners. You jumped the gun. You jumped waaaaay over the gun, lol. And the conclusions you came up with spurred you to make an angry response. If anyone jumped down anyone's throat, it's you.

It happens with every testing. People are always very ready to attack those that are already disappointed, making everyone's disappointment worse. It's bad and it really paints the community in a sad light.

What ALSO happens with every testing is that some people of said community will whine like entitles brats that they didn't get into testing. And some will make thread after thread crying over why they felt they should have been let in, regardless of how testing was handled. That, too, makes a community look pathetic.

I'm sure there are people that are just "butthurt", but I don't know their percentage, nor you do. So I don't necessarily assume that everyone that complains belongs to that group like many here are doing, nor I go ahead and second guess their motives.

Nor do I. However, those who complain, whine, and grumble over and over in multiple new threads that they created that their status as veterans in the game should net them automatic access no matter what are practically transparent in their motives... er, sorry, "beliefs"... and those are the people I was referring to. No "second guessing" is even needed in such cases.

Nope. It's serious to anyone that knows that a company giving their customers wrong information often can lead to serious issues.

And I still don't think this is one of those cases, lol. Just mho.

When you have a loaded rifle pointed at your face, encouraging the killer to shoot isn't exactly a sensible course of action.

Interesting metaphor, but not really all that accurate, since I highly doubt that some misinformation about alpha is gonna be the death of the game. Again, just my humble $0.02.

[Abriael]

Snip

I'll refrain from going on and on about people's motives, as we obviously have different standpoints here. I'll just tell that when you call people "whiners" and "crybabies" and "butthurt" (what a bad word... using it really makes a post irritating), you're being confrontational and insulting, and I doubt you think that your alleged "judgement of people's motives" skill is infallible. If you do... well. That's more your problem than mine.

Choice of words is always important, and walking around with a can of gasoline in a foundry isn't exactly what I'd consider sensible, but to each his own.

And I still don't think this is one of those cases, lol. Just mho.

-Only active accounts are eligible.
-A bunch of people with inactive accounts get into the alpha.

I'm sure it's not hard to notice the contradiction between the two elements above.

Interesting metaphor, but not really all that accurate, since I highly doubt that some misinformation about alpha is gonna be the death of the game. Again, just my humble $0.02.

Strawman argument warning: No one argued that it's gonna be the "death of the game". That kind of negative press is damaging, whether it's a little or a lot depends on how widespread and on the issue at hand. But a developer has to try and avoid it when it can. And in this case it definitely was avoidable.

Just look at how some of the press just tried to raise a stink about the same gender marriage issue. Luckily it kind of fizzled because the spotlight on the game ain't intense enough, but they sure did try (the funnies thing is that they ALL noticed it eight days later than Yoshida mentioned it, way to be on top of the news lol).

[Warlock]

I'll refrain from going on and on about people's motives, as we obviously have different standpoints here. I'll just tell that when you call people "whiners" and "crybabies" and "butthurt" (what a bad word... using it really makes a post irritating), you're being confrontational and insulting, and I doubt you think that your alleged "judgement of people's motives" skill is infallible. If you do... well. That's more your problem than mine.

Choice of words is always important, and walking around with a can of gasoline in a foundry isn't exactly what I'd consider sensible, but to each his own.



-Only active accounts are eligible.
-A bunch of people with inactive accounts get into the alpha.

I'm sure it's not hard to notice the contradiction between the two elements above.



Strawman argument warning: No one argued that it's gonna be the "death of the game". That kind of negative press is damaging, whether it's a little or a lot depends on how widespread and on the issue at hand. But a developer has to try and avoid it when it can. And in this case it definitely was avoidable.

Just look at how some of the press just tried to raise a stink about the same gender marriage issue. Luckily it kind of fizzled because the spotlight on the game ain't intense enough, but they sure did try (the funnies thing is that they ALL noticed it eight days later than Yoshida mentioned it, way to be on top of the news lol).

LOL Dude what part of "You do NOT deserve to be in the alpha more than the next guy" you fail to understand? Chillax man no wall of text is getting you in ...

[Abriael]

LOL Dude what part of "You do NOT deserve to be in the alpha more than the next guy" you fail to understand? Chillax man no wall of text is getting you in ...

From the official application form.

- Must currently have an active FINAL FANTASY XIV account

I'm not sure what part of it you don't understand, 'cause it sounds quite clear to me. I didn't make the rules. I just point out when they're broken.

[whoopeeragon]

From the official application form.

I'm not sure what part of it you don't understand, 'cause it sounds quite clear to me. I didn't make the rules. I just point out when they're broken.

Maybe you understand already what I'm gonna write, but that line was merely for the application. It has NO HOLD whatsoever on who gets accepted save for filtering those into who can access the application.

I do agree that it may be a bug/glitch, because I have a friend who attempted to access the application on an inactive account, but he got denied. That may be it working correctly, but then you have reports from others...it's not honestly that big of a deal because the applicant had to have a shred of interest to even get through the application. SE doesn't up and choose everyone from the huge masses - they review the application and, based on the criteria they laid out for themselves (WHICH THE RULE FOR THE APPLICATION DOES NOT APPLY), they choose the person.

The application rules and process is independent from the alpha testing criteria and selection. The application merely filters through people who want to test from everyone else as well as provide their own personal information. The selection doesn't look for any other information aside from what was provided and based on that criteria, chosen. So the two processes aren't linked.

If anything, the selection of alpha testers went smoothly. It was the APPLICATION which seems to be weirded out. But as I said, it may be a bug/glitch, as it has worked for others, and not so much for some.

EDIT: Not targetting anyone in particular, but it seems as if there are huge misunderstandings about the application, selection, and the NDA. Maybe I should type up a topic related to those three instances just to clear things up.