Dark Knight Changes - Suggestion.

[Shurrikhan]

TBN is a shield, it is not mitigation.

Anything that increases current and maximum eHP is mitigation. %DR is one form of mitigation. Barriers/"shields"/absorbs are another. The heal leading to Adloquiem's barrier is not, but the barrier itself is.

(A cheat death, btw --giving infinite eHP for a time, and effectively nullifying what damage is unable to move you below 1 HP anyways-- is arguably yet another.)

Similarly, both healing (that which increases current but not maximum eHP) and mitigation (that which increases current AND maximum eHP) are forms of sustain (that which keeps you alive for longer).

All tanks suffer in ARR content, especially if you're a seasoned veteran being synced down for roulettes.

It's not just ARR content in which DRK lacks defensive agency. It's all content up until level 70. Nor are other tanks typically quite so ill affected in that range. DRK no longer has Low Blow resets, an AoE Blind, increased parry chance CD (with an optional increased dodge chance), nor a repeatable self-heal -- all things it previously had before level 60.

Dark Mind is fine being a mitigation that prioritizes magic damage, but it does need to at least receive the Addle treatment and work on physical damage at half the normal value so that we can use it for trash pulls in dungeons.

Agreed. And same to Dark Missionary.

No to combining the 1-2-3 combo. If you can't do that much on a dungeon boss, you should just go play one of those idle mobile games that are advertised all over YouTube and Facebook.

"If you don't like using 3 buttons for a singular, inseparable, button-bloated decision, surely the only games for you must play themselves." Ffs...

2. At lv 70 add effect of Oblation to The Blackest Night. Oblation can just be removed.

Do not do this unless you want to be less able to use TBN in casual content without considerable damage loss.

3.Combine Abyss Drain and Salted Earth into 1 skill with 30 sec CD. Remove Abyss Drain. We have skill like that in pvp so they don't even need to make new skill.

Similarly, I'd rather not. If anything, just increase the damage to primary target from Abyssal Drain and remove CnS, give CnS partial cleave damage and healing per hit and remove AD, or give AD a reason to be used over CnS even in single-target (e.g., for emergency sustain, but far more potently).

If we truly struggled for space, I could maybe see decoupling CnS and AD and having each create a sort of zone of effect beneath, but after the BW/Del consolidation, I don't think we are and would rather see more interesting utility attached to Salted Earth and/or Abyssal Drain separately in the future than just see either removed to save one key more.

1.Move The Blackest Night to lv 40 in it's current form. This way DRK will have some kind of mitigation earlier.

4. Allow for Blood Gauge and Blood Skills at lv 30 and just improve it's potency with levels to their current state. The skills just come too late to make class fun to play in low level dungeons.

Do similar for the other tanks, then, but sure. Accelerating access to interesting gameplay (or, just as appropriately, "replacing what's been increasingly lost from early level gameplay") is certainly a good thing.

[mallleable]

I am still of the opinion that they should kinda rebuild DRK from the ground up with the idea of it being able to spend its own HP on attacks, and that it can still be a strong tank even with such a mechanic.

[AnjouMaaka]

Anything that increases current and maximum eHP is mitigation. %DR is one form of mitigation. Barriers/"shields"/absorbs are another.

No where do you see that this fits the description of what effective HP is. Effective HP is the amount of damage you can take before you hit 0. Mitigation is always referred to as a "reduction" of something, in the case of FFXIV, damage received.

[Carighan]

I am still of the opinion that they should kinda rebuild DRK from the ground up with the idea of it being able to spend its own HP on attacks, and that it can still be a strong tank even with such a mechanic.

Yeah, I like ideas-from-PvP for a lot of jobs actually, and this is one of them. I'd make DRK the "drain tank", too. In fact I'd give them:

* Spend HP on some abilities, both defensive and offensive. Offense is strong attacks so you want HP up for burst windows. Defense is something like "Lose 30% max HP but gain a shield equal to 100% of remaining HP, on recovery health is unhealed.", tradeoffs like that.
* Mana exclusively used for emergency healing, instant ability that drains all mana for a self-heal, heals whatever % of mana you managed to lose.
* Multiple sources of DoTs, all drain HP. Some longer, many shorter.
* Very weak defensive ability overall. Strong spike defense (see the shield above, which would be my version of TBN) and otherwise all about constantly draining large amounts of HP to offset the big damage intake from lacking a lot of the defensive stuff other tanks have. Basically like old Blood Death Knight from WoW before they reworked it 15 times.

[Carighan]

No where do you see that this fits the description of what effective HP is. Effective HP is the amount of damage you can take before you hit 0. Mitigation is always referred to as a "reduction" of something, in the case of FFXIV, damage received.

You are just being belligerent on purpose. Everyone but you understands these concepts, and to everyone but you it's intuitive. It's a you-problem, sorry to say.

[Sylvain]

You clearly have never seen this video. Please watch it and straighten out your tank knowledge.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCEovQvASsY

I mean... mitigation is just anything that prevents you from being OS by a tank burster. Wether you reduce incoming damage or shield yourself, if by the end the result is that you didn't die from the blow it's kind of the same.
Healing is different. A war could very well heals for 100% of their hp gcd swing, that won't help prevent a OS.

I really don't see the need to subclassify these things. Sure in practice they scale differently, a shield is stronger the weaker the attack is but so long as it prevents you from going from 100 to 0 in a single hit, that's mitigation.. you mitigated the attack..

[Carighan]

I really don't see the need to subclassify these things. Sure in practice they scale differently, a shield is stronger the weaker the attack is but so long as it prevents you from going from 100 to 0 in a single hit, that's mitigation.. you mitigated the attack..

Plus it's not like the subclassifications don't exist already, and everyone agrees that all things you can pre-apply are forms of mitigation (as in, they reduce the HP damage you take, which can in turn be calculated into what EHP-bonus they provide).

There are roughly three types of mitigation. Percentual, fixed (this is what Anjou insists isn't mitigation to try derail the discussion), absolute (invulns). You could argue there is also Bladeturns (FFXIV doesn't have these yet) but in the end that's just invulns with a duration of "1 hit" or so.

And then just to explain this for some reader who might be confused how MMO mechanics work: mitigation (see above) increases EHP, but healing can also be calculated as EHP, but both mitigation and healing sometimes is difficult to truly calculate (how much EHP is as bladeturn?!). Importantly healing is reactive - it happens after the damage already came in - while mitigation is proactive - you apply it before the damage. And yes, invulnerability is mitigation. As is, btw, dying. Technically. Not in a good way.

[Thanad]

they say "comparison is beginning of despair". it's truth it seems. I have all tanks leveled and play them all and while i think DRK is coolest visually, except running animation, the class is wreck. DRK have Darkside, but so does WAR. But WAR have it as passive on 1,2,3 and in AoE combo. You don't even need to think about it. DRK must spend MP to maintain it. And DRK MP regen sucks. We only have delirium which is quite bad. PLD also use MP but have insane regen on 1,2,3 and passive that cuts spell cost by half, so PLD have virtually infnite MP. Now DRK have lot of oGCD, sure it has. So does GNB but GNB oGCD's don't share CDs with each other. Let's not forget DRK crappy sustain. When you look at class objectively it's a wreck. DRK atm is discounted version of every other tanks

[Supersnow845]

they say "comparison is beginning of despair". it's truth it seems. I have all tanks leveled and play them all and while i think DRK is coolest visually, except running animation, the class is wreck. DRK have Darkside, but so does WAR. But WAR have it as passive on 1,2,3 and in AoE combo. You don't even need to think about it. DRK must spend MP to maintain it. And DRK MP regen sucks. We only have delirium which is quite bad. PLD also use MP but have insane regen on 1,2,3 and passive that cuts spell cost by half, so PLD have virtually infnite MP. Now DRK have lot of oGCD, sure it has. So does GNB but GNB oGCD's don't share CDs with each other. Let's not forget DRK crappy sustain. When you look at class objectively it's a wreck. DRK atm is discounted version of every other tanks

Can you really compare DRK’s mana management to PLD’s

PLD’s mana management is like a healers or PCT’s, I mean it technically exists but in reality it never matters. DRK actually has to manage mana

[Thanad]

That's the point man. If you look at DRK currently it's like all tanks were put into one, just on very high discount.