Request: I don't want to solo the main scenario

[Andrien]

I can't believe I'm blowing my post number 1000 on this.

Anyway.

Those are two of the hardest new generation online RPGs aimed for PS3 players. The first one won game of the year award and the second is a strong candidate.

Implying the new generations, and PS3 audience, aren't open to challenging content is being oblivious to reality.

Not to mention the majority of FFXIV players are former FFXI players who did enjoy the challenging content of XI.
So instead of asking SE to take a step backwards like it did on FFXIV release, we should ask them to improve upon what they had built on.

The content on XI was great, making groups was hard for some people. So don't ask to burn something like that, instead ask for a design that enabled the easy formation of parties and encourages other players to help each other out even when they've cleared the dungeon (wouldn't you repeat a boss fight again if it yielded 2000 seals when repeated when cleared? or maybe for achievements?).

FFXIV should be different and more casual friendly than XI in a different manner, that being that you don't need to camp NMs for weeks, and that you don't need to set aside 3 hours just to EXP, or that it doesn't take 40 minutes to get anywhere, or even that if a few members leave the party you can still go on and you aren't forced to disband.

That's in any case molding to the new generations. Not killing the difficulty and strategy and designing a solo single player game with real people as background NPCs.

Oh I guess I pop your 1000 post cherry huh?
I prefer this than just pictures, thanks for that.

You bring up a good point, that is a good business model to make the game accessible to everyone.

[Andrien]

Here is my debate. There is no hard evidence that making MMO's easier provides more subscribers over the long term which you have claimed it does.

Also the numbers are still on my side. Quit trying to claim they don't matter when they come directly from other members of this forums. Saying their voice doesn't count is just being purposely dense.

I never claimed easy was the way to go, and I gave you some examples of challenging successful MMORPGs that is meant for all types of play styles and yet you talk about numbers on the forum, especially one with a post out voting you on your own thread. But truth be told, what I am claiming for is a more accessible game.

edit: I understand where you coming from Zaaku. But, I'm going to go out on a limb and say a more accessible game pulls in more subs.

[Noir]

Yes there are and I am counting YOU among them. You just said that anyone who wants a harder game is a jobless child who just doesn't understand the complexities of life. That we should bow to your "Voice of experience".

I myself do not fit that insult because I am gainfully employed, own my own house, and am a responsible adult. You still insult me by inferring that I am otherwise because I don't want to be able to beat the game by putting in only 2 hours a day.

Humm, 2 hours a day? Yeah right... Everyone knows thats what takes to play party only content...
I'm not against a harder game, but if by hard you mean party only, yes. Sometimes, takes you 1 hour to form a part of 8. A good one, maybe 2 hours. I don't care if you agree with me or not. But I'm sure most don't agree with you. We gotta havea game that Offers the possibility of all type of gamers to enjoy. I like a hybrid game. Not solo only or party only. That's what final fantasy was promoted for. Otherwise Myself and others wouldn't be here. I'm sure you can find party only content on games from ncsoft rather than SE. They offer your party only content and harder stuff. Of course , since you are a well succeeded person, you can ebay your way up the ladder there. That's one of the things I love about this game. Final fantasy the way it is now, don't need to Go that way we all know and hate. When a game is party only and ridiculously hard, gets flooded with farmers and you all know the end of the story. If that's what you like, you won't find here.

[Zaaku]

There already IS options for people with less time. Leves are basically turbo exp for mobs of comparable levels to EXP mobs and can be scaled to fit any group cluster. You already HAVE your solo content.

Now lets up the time it takes to cap. Make the mobs more dangerous and difficult and reward those who can put together PT's. That is how it is supposed to go. The more you can put in the more you should get out.

[Firon]

People need to stop thinking how much time you play = how hardcore/casual you are. Hell i had a lot less playtime than many folks in xi and accomplished more and played less but i still considered my self hardcore. A hardcore gamer is someone who plays anything and learns the ins and outs of a game not time spent. I always hear retarded ppl say i play FPS cause it has blood that makes it hardcore or some other stupid reason.

If you wanna know hardcore was the RDM taru in XI who learned everything about his class and proceeded to solo many high lvl monster that others could not do that's hardcore someone who took time to learn everything about the game.

Now back to the topic, while i understand you do not want to solo missions, but if them making the missions party only is gonna discourage players from doing it cause they can't find other players then NO it shouldn't be done. They can make the fights just as hard for solo as they can for party play.

[Tahldon]

Man... all these walls of text going back and forth over who's supposed to do what and how... Good Grief, people...

I'll keep this nice and short.

I see the "Red" side trying to overtake the "Blue" side of the whole content thing. People rather like having content that they can do by themselves and with groups, forcing everything to be one side of the coin will just frustrate people on both sides of the fence.

Solo-ers have story content in the form of the Main Scenario.

Party-oriented players have story content in the form of Company Quests (And yes, we know that there aren't many of them, but it's getting there.)

Some of you that are pro-"This is an MMORPG" still have to realize that people have different schedules that may not allow for them to be online when there are throngs of people online to allow for them to do content that requires 7 other people. The fact that people cannot always have a party does not mean that they shouldn't allowed to play the game.

I've seen some posts here that even say something along the lines of "This is an MMORPG, if you don't like it, you can leave!" This is a pretty harsh attitude to have towards people who make up the community. At this point, we're wanting more players to come to the game not banish them away for wanting to play story content by themselves.

Balance guys, can we give each other equal sides of the scale, please?

[Corrderio]

There already IS options for people with less time. Leves are basically turbo exp for mobs of comparable levels to EXP mobs and can be scaled to fit any group cluster. You already HAVE your solo content.

Now lets up the time it takes to cap. Make the mobs more dangerous and difficult and reward those who can put together PT's. That is how it is supposed to go. The more you can put in the more you should get out.

Yeah, but that's kind of all there is and it's pretty meh after awhile. We need more "pick up and go" styles of content.

[Zaaku]

Yeah, but that's kind of all there is and it's pretty meh after awhile. We need more "pick up and go" styles of content.

I am quite certain Hamlet defense will also be another alternate form of group less (Or at least not needing to build a group) EXP. Other things like Campaign will no doubt worm their way in. There are plenty of alternatives for the more casual crowd. I see no reason to further degrade the sense of contention in the world by making things any easier.

[Viritess]

A post got a handful more likes then one of the options I presented. Still is far outnumbered by the combined posts which makes up the poll I total but that is neither here nor there.

You are so blind to your own concept of how an MMO has to work that even when proff is staring you in the face you present outside examples which can not be verified nor calculated. What other MMO's have causalized and received long term benefits? WoW is the only truly sucsessful example and WoW is such a statistical outlyer that it can't be used reasonably.

The posters in THIS forum for THIS game right HERE and NOW want a challenge. Want to actually feel like we're accomplishing something because we had to work for it.

Eh..really wanted to one post here but i can't help it. Must be the long shift.

Lets take the Eve-online that you brushed aside. Faction warfare was an addition and very incomplete. Optionless imbalanced and lacking direction. But it was concidered 0.0 lite. which means it was like the "Hard, difficult challenge" yet also "more accessable" because you could fight like it was lawless space but do it for a couple hours and then log off.

What happened? People ate it up like sugar coated candy. Wonder why.. could have been because all the folks who wanted the same pvp type action you got in Null sec (lawless space/ 0.0) without the 15 hour 200 vs 200 ship standoff. Maybe because they couldn't sit for 15 hours strait yet still wanted a challenge? hmmmm.

With all due respect, your showing your lack of MMO knowlage in this case atleast. To the point that years later CCP (makers of Eve-online) have realized and decided to change their original focus of Faction war from being Null sec training ground to a fully fleshed out system with game changing (Re write the very map) effects. They have likely realiazed as awesome and fun as Null sec space is, having the same (or similar) challenge for less hours strait is not only achivable, but highly desired by the playerbase.

And as a general opinion not directed at anyone in particular, its very important when discussing anything that will have an effect on others, to look past your personal desires and the only option, or even the best. we ALL want what we want. Just try to get a piece of what you want. People want to eat the whole cake and make you watch them eat it.

[Dragon]

Did you just say EVE had casual play. That game is more brutal and unforgiving then FFXI! lol

Lineage II as well. Nether of those examples show long term benefits towards simplifying everything. In fact it has shown just the opposite. IF you make the world in which the players... well plays in. He will stick around longer because his time invested meant something. Gave him purpose and more reason to keep playing.

I cannot believe anyone would call Eve Online or L2 casual... that is just LOLZIES.

Come again?

edit: GUYS. GUYS. THIS IS MY POST 999.

While often considered two of the hardest video games of the new generation, they don't even begin to get hard until your 3rd~4th playthrough on the same character. That's what makes the ~Souls franchise stick out: they start out easy and get harder with each playthrough (RE: actual replay, not a new character), because they definitely are not difficult in either NG or +NG for any avg. player.