Are you happy with role actions? If not, how would you rework them?

[mallleable]

It’s job flavour, esuna was specifically designed as a water action because it was designed for WHM, the other three healers aren’t water based healers (though to be fair I have no idea what element SGE is supposed to be aspected to) so using a water VFX feels rather out of place, it’s not the name esuna it’s the actual action itself

Leeches already exists so I don’t know why they thought to remove it, it would just be the same as saying “use your 30%” you would just say “use your purify equivalent”

Fair. However I suspect there might be janky some under the hood reasons why role actions exist, and we can't just have flavorful version of them.

IIRC SCH, and SGE both use arcane magics, but their differing approaches lead to the development of different spells. So technically not really aspected to anything, more so just 'pure magic.'

[Supersnow845]

There shouldn’t be any restriction considering both leeches and exalted detriment used to exist in the same form as the tanks current 30% the only difference was unlock level

SCH I know is explicitly a wind class, there is dialogue in eden that confirms it, but honestly SGE makes no sense anyway

[mallleable]

I guess a kinda thematic justification for the existence of role actions is that that they are generic common sense skills that any adventurer should know depending on the fighting style they've chosen.

[Rithy255]

Selectable Role Actions... But reworked!!
I'm going to post from a Tank players perspective but this applies to other roles as well.

Anyway what I'd like is for role actions to be selectable, The Idea for this would be that some are longer, shorter, strong or are more effective in different situations. But the selection would instead be Select 1 of 3 similar actions (instead of selecting something like 5 out of 10, where the abilities are completely different)

Example. (Rampart and variants) [1 of 3 can be chosen out the following]
Rampart - 20% Mitigation, Duration 15s CD: 90s [Standard always useful baseline]
Convalescence - 10% Mitigation, AE: Increases healing on you by 20% Duration 20s CD: 90s [Weaker at surviving burst damage, Good In AOE, has synergy with Scholars]
Awareness - 10% Mitigation Duration 25s CD: 60S [Weakest mitigation, On the shortest CD, Lasts longest]

What would happen to Required Actions Such as Provoke? or arms length? It's pretty simple, they would become Normal Actions Mainly just flavoured, Effects like slow on arms length *could* change depending on Job ect. (Or not).

I also want to quickly mention Phys ranged as foot graze and other skills are pretty useless, I would like to imagine that phys ranged would get more utility based role actions as they are listed as "providing support to allies" in the job guide.

[Brixy]

I would like to see a mixture of role actions and cross class. All tanks get their 30% mit buttons at lv.38, but warrior just randomly has a straight up superior version than the other tanks. If you have warrior leveled, let the other tanks you play also have access to Vengeance. Same for their Endwalker mit buttons. Unlock their unique mit buttons for all other tanks once they reach the appropriate level. Warrior having access to TBN doesn't change much, other than having a better tank buster button. However, bloodwhetting on Dark Knight would absolutely fix their dungeon issues of having very little self sustain.

It would reward some versatility options for playing additional jobs and also bridge the gaps in the leveling process where some jobs feel like straight downgrades to each other. Why would I ever willingly choose to run a dungeon on DRK and have to pressure my healer when I could do it on WAR and sustain myself while also speeding up the run? This solution fixes that problem without stepping on any toes and universally makes all the tanks feel better to play since you could mix and match their mit buttons (all on a shared recast obviously).

[Lyth]

SCH I know is explicitly a wind class, there is dialogue in eden that confirms it

I was wondering where you were drawing this theory from. There is a SCH-specific dialogue line in 'Into the Firestorm' (Lv.80) where you are offered an explanation on how the weather works that you can pre-empt as SCH. It's a reference to the fact that the Nymians were excellent sailors in general and Scholars were an essential part of the Nymian Marines, so they were naturally knowledgeable about the weather. The discussion on the wind directly ties into the explanation of how water vapour gives rise to clouds and comes up in all three dialogue options, so you shouldn't take that to mean that Scholars are specifically 'wind mages'. mallleable is correct, and you might also have noticed that 'Shadow Flare' wasn't a particularly 'wind-aspected' spell back in the day either.

[Supersnow845]

Bloodwhetting should be deleted, not disseminated to the other three tanks giving every tank a pick of the bunch of all tank mitigation just further invalidates the entire healer role, tanks are already far too strong

I was wondering where you were drawing this theory from. There is a SCH-specific dialogue line in 'Into the Firestorm' (Lv.80) where you are offered an explanation on how the weather works that you can pre-empt as SCH. It's a reference to the fact that the Nymians were excellent sailors in general and scholars were an essential part of the Nymian Marines, so they were naturally knowledgeable about the weather. The discussion on the wind directly ties into the explanation of how water vapour gives rise to clouds and comes up in all three dialogue options, so you shouldn't take that to mean that Scholars are specifically 'wind mages'. mallleable is correct, and you might also have noticed that 'Shadow Flare' isn't a particularly 'wind-aspected' spell either.

It’s also the lore of the nymeians and their skills, the patron diety of nymia was oschon, SCH’s old skill descriptions were far more wind based than they are now (succor used to mention healing wind if I remember correctly) same as leeches and now expedient

They aren’t “wind mages” per say but their aspectation leans more heavily to wind than any other class given the nymian society it originates from

[Lyth]

I think it's a bit difficult to draw a direct correlation, as it's all vague at best. If anything, the signature 'Aero' was White Magic.

If anything, I would have expected 'Leeches' to have been more water-aspected, given that the healing practice that the spell is named after was originally derived from utilizing marine creatures. Airborne Leeches would be somewhat worrying.

[Rein_eon_Osborne]

[...]This solution fixes that problem without stepping on any toes and universally makes all the tanks feel better to play since you could mix and match their mit buttons (all on a shared recast obviously).

???

Bloodwhetting already steps on every green dps' toes in a way that no other job can do, not even any green dps can do either lol.

[Raikai]

Role actions to me are just like an antiquated relic in today's design of this game. I see the following issues:

1) A big chunk of those actions are useless in harder content, and even in the content they are actually usable, stuff dies too fast for them to even be remotely relevant

2) Uninspiring actions like Lucid Dream or Rampart, which could be so much more if they were unique mechanics to their jobs

Honestly, the only really 'needed' Role actions are the KB immunities*, Esuna and Provoke. The rest, I could see done with and corresponding effects baked in the job's personal utility kits so we get at least some distinction in that front, since Role Actions aren't really tied to damage performance.

* Even that one is questionable, because if a KB immunity is always up when a KB puzzle happens, what's even the point of the mechanic?