Luckybancho census shows criterion savage was a complete and utter failure

[Solakor]

I don't think that was what they were trying at all. What they were doing is trying to make content that required less testing that could fill the same role for post game grind content so that they can keep the lights on for the server. Unfortunately, savage and hard mode content are cheap to make compared to entire zones with unique encounters, hence why instead of building Eureka, they built island sanctuary and criterion. Island Sanctuary is completely non-combat based and forms the "adventure" kind of content, while the variant dungeons are the combat end and criterion + criterion savage are the current challenge mode content similar to how Bozja had the special fates that you could 1v1 a guy.

The problem they got right now is that people would rather just stop playing than complete the hardmode content they released and this isn't just applying to Criterion Savage. Standard Savage has no life left in it at all. People who are still trying to clear are basically zombies that are doing it because we have social obligations and sunk cost fallacy. The sooner it gets done the sooner it can be dropped and I'm pretty sure a lot of people can back me up on that one. It's discouraging to even say that, considering how much effort people put in to clearing it, but that's why I've been beating that horse for ages that they need to at least put in some kind of echo at this point because there isn't going to be anyone left.

But i don't understand why they made the normal content so braindead easy which in turn made you play less because its one and done content now rather than having some bite that kept things interesting.
Also they already had this concept of HARD mode dungeons that they could utilize. Like make it a weekly or daily. Make the mobs a bit harder and put some more of the usual mechanics in there and bam, job done.
Reward could be like you run it 4 times a week and you can then exchange the rewards for something endgame gear related etc.
Also maby utilizing the overworld more so they don't have to craft whole new zones?

In regards to IS, i dunno how they can ship something like this out when you can just buy stardew valley etc that does this and way better.
Why are the devs not playing to the games strenghts or are making things half baked? ff16? Graphics update? Who knows at this point but they can do better because they have done better in the past.

[Colt47]

The most insulting thing about the weapons is that you need the P11S material to make it instead of the weapon being a straight drop. Relics are around the corner so the ilvl is useless. I'm not going back to the tier I cleared months ago to upgrade for a mediocre glow. Imagine if they made you use the weapon upgrade to make Ultimate weapons glow lol.

And then you got the casual crowd / "I thought I was mid-core but then the group schedule went to absolute crap" people who are anywhere from just clearing the tier now, to still getting p12s done, and given they struggle to get a group to actually play for two days for three hours, they definitely aren't doing savage criterion.

Then again, this is a weird tier because p10s at the start of the tier with only base gear was kind of... well we got the final boss and he's the second fight. It took some serious perseverance to keep going past that fight week after week at least until the gear got better. Then there is general burn out going on with the expansion near its close also draining people and it's a perfect storm to just have content die on a funeral pyre. Also, hard fights that are basically a DnD GM slapping 3 monster templates on ancient dragon so that it has only a narrow way of being defeated, and then forcing people to run through hoops of fire to kill said dragon, is sort of a tiresome industry standard with MMO end game that feels dated like a dinosaur. I highly doubt that is the only option for making end game last, let alone appeal to the largest possible pot of long haulers.

[NekoMataMata]

I don't think the issue was the rewards as much as it was SE forget who the audience for IS should be. Should it be the hardcore raiders who have mostly already dropped the game until DT release, or should it be the more casual-midcore players who are sticking around in the meantime?

Didn't think it'd be a hard one to figure out.

[Colt47]

I don't think the issue was the rewards as much as it was SE forget who the audience for IS should be. Should it be the hardcore raiders who have mostly already dropped the game until DT release, or should it be the more casual-midcore players who are sticking around in the meantime?

Didn't think it'd be a hard one to figure out.

Plus just because non-hardcore players do hardcore content doesn't mean it is great content for that group of players, they just do it because it is the only thing to do. Most people hate savage for the most part since it doesn't give any kind of reward until someone clears a fight and clearing these fights is a leap and bounds effort above an EX trial. Savage content tends to generate a lot of bad experiences for anyone without a lot of extra time and interest to knock it out in a short period of time.

[Maltothoris]

Also want to point that when people do clear the savages they never want to go back in to help others as well.

[xbahax92]

Also want to point that when people do clear the savages they never want to go back in to help others as well.

You can however do savages an expansion later with unsync party settings and get the glamours pretty easily. Whereas criterion dungeons will be (probably) forever synced and the rewards still suck. Waste of opportunity.

[OgruMogru]

Also want to point that when people do clear the savages they never want to go back in to help others as well.

This is partly the fault of the way the loot system works. Doesn't matter if it's early in the tier or a few months in the playerbase has been trained to not re-enter the fights after their weekly clear because they will be a detriment to the group's chance at getting loot. I'm sure there are players that don't mind but a lot of people are reluctant to give up on the *chance* for max chests. So once people are done with their gearing they still can't help others or go for practice without being a loss with their presence, even months after the raid tier is relevant.

[Supersnow845]

Can’t the system just be programmed that everyone get one “roll” at loot per week, then after that if you go back in and you have 4 people that have rolled and 4 that haven’t the game just has 4 “sleeper rolls” that if a sleeper wins the loot just gets deleted, that way everyone has the same chance but you don’t punish others for going back in a second time to help them

[OgruMogru]

Can’t the system just be programmed that everyone get one “roll” at loot per week, then after that if you go back in and you have 4 people that have rolled and 4 that haven’t the game just has 4 “sleeper rolls” that if a sleeper wins the loot just gets deleted, that way everyone has the same chance but you don’t punish others for going back in a second time to help them

This would be ideal, imo! The 24 man loot system works this way. You get a token for completing and you can roll on a piece of loot and once you win something you can't roll on anything else. Granted this would limit people to 1 piece of gear per savage floor per week [plus a book] but if you don't have BiS priority in a static then you'd be taking that chance on weekly rolls anyways. It could even mean you could be guaranteed to nab yourself 1 bit of loot a week if you're willing to keep clearing it.

[Maltothoris]

I think I need to clarify. I meant for the criterion savages. Because this is all the loot you get from them https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/w...ihn_Manuscript https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/w...kon_Manuscript https://ffxiv.consolegameswiki.com/w...alo_Manuscript
Aloalo is the only one that's different with the esters that you get from it but the others really don't offer much for people to redo them.