A summary of healer issues

[Renathras]

You said "it favours groups that coordinate their buffs", I'm saying that groups that coordinate their buffs already do so without the changes, so how does it favour them? What net benefit do they gain? If you're talking about people in alliance raids, those are on the lower end of the level, so your argument that it's not for the lowest isn't exactly correct either.

People who use their buffs together actively do more DPS. I...would think that obvious, but that's what I mean by favors.

That change, btw, seemed targeted at the midcore. The "lowest common denominator" players don't line buffs up even now. What it did was make the midcore more capable of consistent buff alignment, and made it easier for the hardcore to to line up buffs - contrary to your statement, they weren't all coordinated in ShB simply because there were so many different CDs - 45 sec, 90 sec, 60 sec, etc - that there was just no way to get them to play nice together. High end players either picked all Jobs that had compatible CDs, or they just picked which were most beneficial to line up. The EW change streamlined this for those players, thus making things easier for them. Note that this is another definition of "favors/benefits".

So it was made for the midcore, and it helped the midcore and the hardcore. Casual/"lowest common denominator" players weren't then, and still aren't now, lining up buffs and keeping buff uptime, etc, so the change wasn't made for them, didn't help them, and if anything, has made their performance worse by relative comparison since everyone else is now doing it, and doing it better, than they were before, growing the gap.

I didn't say it was a good argument, I am merely stipulating a sensible line of logic for a balance team to consider when balancing for an individual patch. Can you imagine the groaning if parties start demanding SMN and RDM consistently, because they've been buffed to do the same damage as melees? I can, and I imagine someone in charge of balancing the game would want to avoid it. I don't like how the game is presently balanced please stop trying to argue with me, I don't want to.

Maybe, I just don't think it's really valid.

I think the system is what it always has been - one of each and one wildcard slot to fill as the party sees fit.

.

EDIT: Bah, daily limit. Well, will just have to make due with this.

Close, it was a change aimed at the casual (helping them to align buffs easier), had zero impact on anyone with a modicum of skill at the game (who can already line up their buffs/delay when it's called for), and as you say, STILL doesn't actually get the casuals to align their buffs every time. Thus, the change was 'good intentions, bad execution/implementation', because all it's done is remove an aspect of optimization from the high end, without doing much to raise the low end. People can still drift DragonSight or Battle Voice so hard Vin Diesel would be impressed, and that's if they even use them at all

No, it's what I said - for the midcore. Casuals weren't anywhere close to doing it, while midcore players were trying but failing. The change was made for the latter, not the former, and benefited the latter, along with the hardcores by making the square peg they were trying to fit into a round hole into a round peg so it actually fit.

But I do agree it was bad execution, and it was apparent almost immediately it wasn't working as intended, yet they stuck with it anyway, even though it clearly didn't help the casual low end, annoyed the high end, and while it helped the midcore "feel better", since encounters were then balanced around the expectation of that level of damage, things didn't really change for them - before they weren't aligning buffs and were clearing content with difficulty, now they're aligning buffs and clearing content with difficulty.

So it was a failure all around and......and deja vu. Hm. I feel like we've had this conversation before. And I don't mean this topic. I mean, that I've typed that EXACT conversation before. Weird.

[ForsakenRoe]

So it was made for the midcore, and it helped the midcore and the hardcore. Casual/"lowest common denominator" players weren't then, and still aren't now, lining up buffs and keeping buff uptime, etc, so the change wasn't made for them, didn't help them, and if anything, has made their performance worse by relative comparison since everyone else is now doing it, and doing it better, than they were before, growing the gap.

Close, it was a change aimed at the casual (helping them to align buffs easier), had zero impact on anyone with a modicum of skill at the game (who can already line up their buffs/delay when it's called for), and as you say, STILL doesn't actually get the casuals to align their buffs every time. Thus, the change was 'good intentions, bad execution/implementation', because all it's done is remove an aspect of optimization from the high end, without doing much to raise the low end. People can still drift DragonSight or Battle Voice so hard Vin Diesel would be impressed, and that's if they even use them at all

[Aravell]

That change, btw, seemed targeted at the midcore. The "lowest common denominator" players don't line buffs up even now. What it did was make the midcore more capable of consistent buff alignment, and made it easier for the hardcore to to line up buffs - contrary to your statement, they weren't all coordinated in ShB simply because there were so many different CDs - 45 sec, 90 sec, 60 sec, etc - that there was just no way to get them to play nice together. High end players either picked all Jobs that had compatible CDs, or they just picked which were most beneficial to line up. The EW change streamlined this for those players, thus making things easier for them. Note that this is another definition of "favors/benefits".

You seem to have a severe misunderstanding of the hardcore, not a single higher end player actually picked jobs based on raid buff timers, jobs were picked based on what they brought to the table and who can maximise the use of those buffs. In regards to the timers, you are also wrong there, you just have to add it up, 45s will naturally align with 90s and also with 180s, 30s and 60s will naturally align with 120s, and every single buff aligns at 360s, if a fight doesn't last for 12 mins, everyone just delayed 120s to align at 9 mins. I say again, what did the higher end players gain from the EW change? I'll admit that the midcore maybe could benefit from it, but you're adamant that the hardcore also benefit from this, what did they gain?

[ForsakenRoe]

if a fight doesn't last for 12 mins, everyone just delayed 120s to align at 9 mins.

Now that I think about it, I'm surprised SE hasn't reduced the potion CD to 4min for HQ, instead of 4.30, since that way they'd line up at... 4 minute burst window, rather than 'oops the burst window was like 25s ago, guess we're holding the second potion until 6mins'. Not that I want em to make that change, it's the one remnant we have of 'ok delay pot/buff for better fight mechanic alignment', like doorboss this tier, potting on CD puts it in the middle of LC where... you can't hit the boss. Potting when the boss comes back isn't in a raidbuff window, but people will have their 1min buffs I guess. So you hold it till the next 2min window, and that's fine because A: it's between two Superchain sections and B: Fight's 7:40, so you were only ever gonna get 2 potions regardless

Calling it now, 7.0 will introduce a new variety of potion, going from potions, to infusions, to tinctures, we're gonna get 'Grade 1 Concoction of Mind' and it'll be a 4min CD in either quality (NQ/HQ changes the amount of bonus stat it grants). Also while I'm ranting, can they make potions (and sprint) buffer properly like OGCDs do so we can use them without it feeling all janky clippy

[Aravell]

Now that I think about it, I'm surprised SE hasn't reduced the potion CD to 4min for HQ, instead of 4.30, since that way they'd line up at... 4 minute burst window, rather than 'oops the burst window was like 25s ago, guess we're holding the second potion until 6mins'. Not that I want em to make that change, it's the one remnant we have of 'ok delay pot/buff for better fight mechanic alignment', like doorboss this tier, potting on CD puts it in the middle of LC where... you can't hit the boss. Potting when the boss comes back isn't in a raidbuff window, but people will have their 1min buffs I guess. So you hold it till the next 2min window, and that's fine because A: it's between two Superchain sections and B: Fight's 7:40, so you were only ever gonna get 2 potions regardless

Calling it now, 7.0 will introduce a new variety of potion, going from potions, to infusions, to tinctures, we're gonna get 'Grade 1 Concoction of Mind' and it'll be a 4min CD in either quality (NQ/HQ changes the amount of bonus stat it grants). Also while I'm ranting, can they make potions (and sprint) buffer properly like OGCDs do so we can use them without it feeling all janky clippy

I miss the days when potting on cd used to be worth it, but with the full alignment every 2 mins design they wrought, it's no longer worth using pots at any moment outside of burst. Wouldn't surprise me if they did make the new pot align perfectly though.

[Shurrikhan]

I miss the days when potting on cd used to be worth it, but with the full alignment every 2 mins design they wrought, it's no longer worth using pots at any moment outside of burst. Wouldn't surprise me if they did make the new pot align perfectly though.

Aye. Something like...

NQ - 5 minutes' recast time (but maybe a higher portion of the HQ stats)
HQ - 4 minutes' recast time

/sigh