The current state of the "MMORPG" FFXIV is unsustainable. Here's why

[Elucesta]

I can definitely see the difference between those who actually play and enjoy "Old School" mmos and those who just play FF14 and claim they play MMO's.

[Zaniel]

I can definitely see the difference between those who actually play and enjoy "Old School" mmos and those who just play FF14 and claim they play MMO's.

Yeah? Which games are those, tell us, which parts? I'm interested in what you think is "old school" (and good).

[Elucesta]

Yeah? Which games are those, tell us, which parts? I'm interested in what you think is "old school" (and good).

No, you're not going to insert the condition "and good" to narrow or minimize anything i list. So as I said "Old Skool" being: DnD online, Lotr: Online, obviously WoW, Terra, Runescape. To name a few.

[Elucesta]

Oh and also add in star wars Kotr

[Zaniel]

No, you're not going to insert the condition "and good" to narrow or minimize anything i list. So as I said "Old Skool" being: DnD online, Lotr: Online, obviously WoW, Terra, Runescape. To name a few.

I can definitely see the difference between those who actually play and enjoy "Old School" mmos and those who just play FF14 and claim they play MMO's.

Well the implication in your post is that people who play FF14 aren't "real" MMO players and that true hard core people would have played "actual" old school MMOs. The secondary implication seeming to be that the design of systems in these older MMOs was the real deal or "enjoyable" and FF14 is just pretending. Correct me if you meant something else.

I also thought, seeing as you're age-flexing, that you meant actual old school, you know, Everquest, DAOC, Lineage 1, Ultima, Anarchy Online, even EVE etc; the pre-WoW generation. (also, no need to bother quoting some obscure pre-EQ MMO off MMORPG.com, we get the point)

So if these older games were more real or more hardcore, or "better" than FF14 (or whatever definition you were implying), I'd like to know some specifics. What makes them better than FF14? Present your ideas.

Add: It's also a bit funny to talk about old school when the vast majority of the games we're talking about were made within a a couple of years of one another. From beginning to end this whole genre era is like 15 years old (looking at release dates from about 1999 to 2014) and most were made in a block from 2004-2011.

[Elucesta]

Well the implication in your post is that people who play FF14 aren't "real" MMO players and that true hard core people would have played "actual" old school MMOs. The secondary implication seeming to be that the design of systems in these older MMOs was the real deal or "enjoyable" and FF14 is just pretending. Correct me if you meant something else.

I also thought, seeing as you're age-flexing, that you meant actual old school, you know, Everquest, DAOC, Lineage 1, Ultima, Anarchy Online, even EVE etc; the pre-WoW generation. (also, no need to bother quoting some obscure pre-EQ MMO off MMORPG.com, we get the point)

So if these older games were more real or more hardcore, or "better" than FF14 (or whatever definition you were implying), I'd like to know some specifics. What makes them better than FF14? Present your ideas.

Add: It's also a bit funny to talk about old school when the vast majority of the games we're talking about were made within a a couple of years of one another. From beginning to end this whole genre era is like 15 years old (looking at release dates from about 1999 to 2014) and most were made in a block from 2004-2011.

I said "To name a few" that doesn't mean I wouldn't include those MMO's you mentioned as well. I've played those listed above, and tbh I enjoy eve online the most for its in depth in-game economical structure( but thats another conversation). Point is I'm not going to name all of them, but imncertsin you've gotten the point. And yes I will correct you because it seems you miss understand me.

When I say I can tell the difference, what i really mean is : There is nothing wrong with grind here and there, everything does not need to be overly accessible or easy ALL of the time. Inconvenience does not always equal bad. Conversely, too much convenience can lead to either laziness or lack of trying from gamers. IMO, there is a such thing as making an MMO or game in general TOO accessible/Convenient. For an MMO specifically, part of connecting with other players and forging bonds comes from challenges that are hard to overcome. Tbh, the normal combat content in this game is lacking, the overworld is pretty dead, fates are barely working anymore unless you specifically seek out a discord to hunt. There's not reason whatsoever to actually connect or chat with any other player. Bozja was good for that, Eureka was also good for that. It felt more in line to an mmo game. Now everything is so "safe" and "sterile" people can't even take a criticism in chat or else you'll be reported.