Question for the people who don't dislike the 2nd relic step

[Xirean]

Why would you not do hunt trains for it ? Is there an artificial reason why you should go at the slowest pace possible ?

Because some people don't like hunts? Because people want to "farm" the tomes in a way that is more agreeable to them? Because not everybody is looking for the most optimal method to completion. I like these steps because I can do basically whatever high level content I want and make passive progress. The point is that it does not require dedicated focus.

[Stormpeaks]

Because some people don't like hunts? Because people want to "farm" the tomes in a way that is more agreeable to them? Because not everybody is looking for the most optimal method to completion. I like these steps because I can do basically whatever high level content I want and make passive progress. The point is that it does not require dedicated focus.

That's literally like those people saying that islands are supposed to be done at a very slow pace, it's a pretty ridiculous argument, slowing on purpose to make it last longer does not make it better content

[Valkyrie_Lenneth]

That's literally like those people saying that islands are supposed to be done at a very slow pace, it's a pretty ridiculous argument, slowing on purpose to make it last longer does not make it better content

So in that case brayflox hm was the epitomy of good content then.

[Xirean]

That's literally like those people saying that islands are supposed to be done at a very slow pace, it's a pretty ridiculous argument, slowing on purpose to make it last longer does not make it better content

You're missing the point entirely then. It's not about extending the content it's about enjoying it in whatever way a person chooses. People don't have to do the most optimal strategy. They can take it slow and there is no penalty. I've been slowly making progress while doing mentor roulette. I don't have to get tomestones at a fast rate. I'm perfectly fine getting them at whatever rate I get them then just buy meteor stones whenever I pop into Radz for other gear. It's very pleasing because I don't have to stop doing what I was already doing.

[Nezerius]

Getting the base ARR Relic? Go to your designated location, find the weathered version, kill a few enemies, a few tomestones and the vessel weapon, then Chimera/Hydra/Amdapor and you're set.

The Saga of the Zodiac Weapons didn't start until the Atma step. I've already gone over this in this very thread.

HW weapons? If you made a Zeta for the same job you didn't even have to do the first step, which wasn't even that bad and also took only a few hours of FATE grinding.

Sure, you could skip it with a Zeta weapon. Although I doubt you could do the first step in "a few hours", considering you needed 3 crystals from each zone. This is back before they reduced that step to 1 crystal from each zone.

My point is that there have always been short and long steps.
There will be long steps ahead, don't you worry about that.

Except there's only two major patches left, and we've only had shorts steps so far. Telling people to not worry about it is basically echoing Stormpeaks' post "just wait till 6.4.5 guys it gets better".

[Renathras]

...

Honestly, I was more upset about it until I thought about it. My first thought was "1500 tomes...again? The EXACT same thing?!" when I was expecting more of a grind. But then I remembered how much the forums/etc were complaining FOR MONTHS about ShB's being too grindy, even though ShB was the least grindy and most acomodating of any Relic "grind" in history at level.

Further, I was thinking "Couldn't they have made it where we could run dungeons or Orthos for stuff to trade in for the Relic?" Then I realized...that we can. We're getting the applicable tomes any time we run end-game content, including Orthos. We just aren't getting some item, or trading the tomes for an item to trade for another item (like the "Unidentified Seed/Bone/etc" in HW). It's just cutting out the conversion factor steps between several "middle-man" items. It's as if the Devs are saying to us "You complained about only being able to progress your Relic in Eureka, then you complained when we said you could use Bozja or specific other things like FATEs or Dungeons, and you complained at having to convert and collect between tomes and a bunch of resources, and you complained about having it tied to an Exploration Content zone...so we just ripped all of that out and are letting you get your tomes in any way you want and then convert them directly into Relics without all the steps. HAPPY NOW??!?!"

I feel like that's kinda what's going on. And after thinking about it, I can't fault them for it.

"Run Orthos 30 times" or "spend 30x Orthos runs worth of tomes", is really a 6 one way, half a dozen the other situation. It just lacks the "flavor" feel of past Relics. But that "flavor" resulted in grinds that PEOPLE ENDLESSLY COMPLAINED ABOUT.

It's really a case of "this is why we can't have nice things" that has inundated the game. People want Jobs to be unique, but when one sufficiently is, people complain. People want encounters to be diverse or require more mitigation or healing or coordination or whatever, but when they are, people complain about it (or worse, use cheat add-ons to make it easier AND THEN complain about it anyway). People won't stop complaining, so Devs keep making things more and more streamlined and soulless.

Then people complain about THAT.

Honestly, people need to stop complaining about every little thing.

[DiaDeem]

The Saga of the Zodiac Weapons didn't start until the Atma step

It's still a step for the same relic at the end of the day, and you know this. Why are you moving the goal posts? OG and Zenith Steps were purple weapons, they were always called relics and are relics. You're coming across as dishonest with this one.

Sure, you could skip it with a Zeta weapon. Although I doubt you could do the first step in "a few hours"

You could. Those drop rates were always rather generous.

Except there's only two major patches left

You know they can still add long steps within that time frame, right?
As to "wait till it gets better" I never spoke about better or worse with you. You first addressed me and you did it discussing quest length, not quality.

Length doesn't equal quality and the topics have nothing to do with one another. Fighting Chimera and Hydra was way more fun and interesting at the time than farming 60 HW FATEs for Resistance, but the FATEs certainly took longer.

If you wanna talk about quality, I fall somewhere in the middle, as I think there's positives and negatives about just farming astronomy, and all I know is that while this step is hardly the best, it's also far from the worst they can make.

[grinkdaboy]

imagine resubbing just to farm fates/old content lol

[Nezerius]

It's still a step for the same relic at the end of the day, and you know this. Why are you moving the goal posts? OG and Zenith Steps were purple weapons, they were always called relics and are relics. You're coming across as dishonest with this one.

If you've read my previous posts in this thread, my stance has always been that the Saga of the Zodiac Weapons is the start of the Zeta questchain.
I'd love to know how you consider this to be "moving the goal posts" or "coming across as dishonest".

You could. Those drop rates were always rather generous.

My experience with the step tells otherwise.

You know they can still add long steps within that time frame, right?
As to "wait till it gets better" I never spoke about better or worse with you. You first addressed me and you did it discussing quest length, not quality.

The general statement of "just wait till x, it'll get better", or any variation of it, is one that's often said against players who even dare to complain about any update.
Players have every right to be worried about an aspect of the game, without being told to stop worrying, because "the devs can still do x!". Especially after getting two short steps in a row.

And as I've already explained in a previous post, the x.55 step is generally a victory lap, so that leaves the 6.45 one.

[DiaDeem]

If you've read my previous posts in this thread, my stance has always been that the Saga of the Zodiac Weapons is the start of the Zeta questchain.
I'd love to know how you consider this to be "moving the goal posts" or "coming across as dishonest".

Because whether you consider the Zenith weapons part of the Zodiac quest or not, they are in fact steps required to get them. Saying they aren't is just not true by fact, and the weapons even share the same design all the way to the Zeta step. But for the sake of argument, let's say Zenith is an entirely different relic. My point still stand and may be even stronger with this weird line of thought, because now you're telling me we could fully complete an entire Relic in two or three days, with each step taking no more than a couple hours tops. So: Short steps don't mean bad quests. Length has nothing to do with quality.

My experience with the step tells otherwise.

Not gonna argue this one anymore because I can't know what your experience was. Mine was a rather quick step. I don't think you're lying, but neither am I.

The general statement of "just wait till x, it'll get better"

I made no such general statement of quality of the sort. All I did was answer OP's question as to why I don't mind this step, which again: May not be the best, but it's far from the worst. I never said it's gonna get better or worse, that's beyond the scope of my argument. I said it's probably gonna get lengthier, and if it doesn't I'll just eat my words, but my argument about length has nothing to do with quality. They're separate elements, I can't stress this enough.

You have all the right in the world to worry, but pretending this step is THE WORST RELIC QUEST STEP I feel is born out of ignorance as to how bad relic steps can actually get, or is just being alarmist. I don't think you're either.

Calling this the worst step ever however is a plain overreaction.