What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[Lunaxia]

snip

I understand what you're saying, but I don't agree with it. When other users come into this thread and have strips torn off them for doing more or less the same thing to us regarding Venat/ the Ancients and so on, I'm not inclined to let it slide when we start using it against each other, regardless of the how or why behind it. We've less excuse than they do for resorting to such measures when too often we've been on the receiving end of it, and it's something we should be very aware of throwing around. Hostility or bad faith don't even come into it for me, it's just a matter of avoiding outright hypocrisy. If you felt the need to explain because you felt my post was a swipe at you, it wasn't; I saw your post and appreciate the acknowledgement. It was a general bewilderment towards a trend of thinking I've seen from multiple users I felt needed comment. That post I replied to in particular was especially odd to me, because there are many reasons to think that comparing Magnai and G'raha is like apples and oranges without falling on such out of place reasoning.

Uh, no? The actual problem is that the argument relied on those famous Weasel Words "many people" [dislike G'raha Tia], which is irrelevant given the fan-favorite status of the character. The way it seems intended, as Brinne said above, is "lots of people agree with me, so I must be correct on some level."

Just going to quote what I said, since I don't think you're listening.

I don't think even you know what argument you're trying to make at this point.

[tokinokanatae]

Jullus is great. I'm hoping he at least shows up when we find out more about what the twins are doing--ideally with Maximus as they work to create a functioning government with the people that have chosen to remain in Garlemald. I love that sort of thing, and I'm hoping keeping the twins offscreen as long as they have is because they're planning to delve into it a little more than they traditionally have in HW and SB.

[Theodric]

That makes me think about future housing zones. Garlemald could be cool but it would rely a lot on architecture to differentiate it from Ishgard. Smileton I think would be a great housing zone.

Assuming they tap into the Russian and Roman aesthetics, it'd bring unique assets to the table. Especially if it's all mixed with magitek. They don't necessarily need to add a housing zone so much as Garlean housing 'skins' and various indoor and outdoor furniture to suit such a flavour.

[KizuyaKatogami]

I understand what you're saying, but I don't agree with it. When other users come into this thread and have strips torn off them for doing more or less the same thing to us regarding Venat/ the Ancients and so on, I'm not inclined to let it slide when we start using it against each other, regardless of the how or why behind it. We've less excuse than they do for resorting to such measures when too often we've been on the receiving end of it, and it's something we should be very aware of throwing around. Hostility or bad faith don't even come into it for me, it's just a matter of avoiding outright hypocrisy. If you felt the need to explain because you felt my post was a swipe at you, it wasn't; I saw your post and appreciate the acknowledgement. It was a general bewilderment towards a trend of thinking I've seen from multiple users I felt needed comment. That post I replied to in particular was especially odd to me, because there are many reasons to think that comparing Magnai and G'raha is like apples and oranges without falling on such out of place reasoning.



I don't think even you know what argument you're trying to make at this point.

Thank you this was essentially the only point i was trying to make this entire time. I just hate the double standard of it all.

[aveyond-dreams]

Jullus is great. I'm hoping he at least shows up when we find out more about what the twins are doing--ideally with Maximus as they work to create a functioning government with the people that have chosen to remain in Garlemald. I love that sort of thing, and I'm hoping keeping the twins offscreen as long as they have is because they're planning to delve into it a little more than they traditionally have in HW and SB.

Sidequests in the zone revealed that the remaining royal family was destroyed by rampant machina and then the role quest went on to reveal that there were some members of the senate that survived. Garlemald will be neutered into being another cookie cutter democracy and the writers will then pivot away from it because if the role quest was any indication, they cannot wait to be done with Garlemald's involvement in the plot.

No Larsa to lead the empire into brighter days like back in FFXII's ending, just the same stale preaching. I for one remember how Gabranth entrusted Basch with protecting Larsa and taking up his alias as a judge - a tragic moment for the character seeing as it forever separated him from Asche and Dalmasca but it made the ending all the better.



Imagine if a character like Thancred was given a similar treatment and send-off, what better way could there be for him to exit the plot if not that? Say one of the royal family members did survive but their bodyguard perished, and in order to protect the world's political stability Thancred choose to stay behind in Garlemald to act as their guardian. Continuing his role as a protector and fatherlike figure, while still having the stealthy element of impersonating someone else. Alas this writing is likely too deep for the playerbase, who apparently can only accept "yay democracy!" as the tried and true solution for complex political dilemmas.

[Theodric]

Sidequests in the zone revealed that the remaining royal family was destroyed by rampant machina and then the role quest went on to reveal that there were some members of the senate that survived. Garlemald will be neutered into being another cookie cutter democracy and the writers will then pivot away from it because if the role quest was any indication, they cannot wait to be done with Garlemald's involvement in the plot.

No Larsa to lead the empire into brighter days like back in FFXII's ending, just the same stale preaching.

It's a shame, too, since from what I've seen over the years many of the more passionate Garlean fans were consistently asking for just that - a Larsa type figure to step up much sooner. I don't know what they were thinking in hindsight, especially since they seem to have squandered much of the potential that the likes of Regula brought to the table.

It'd bother me less if the writers weren't treating certain in-game nations clearly inspired by real world counterparts with kid's gloves but then making outright caricatures out of others.

[Lunaxia]

Sidequests in the zone revealed that the remaining royal family was destroyed by rampant machina and then the role quest went on to reveal that there were some members of the senate that survived. Garlemald will be neutered into being another cookie cutter democracy and the writers will then pivot away from it because if the role quest was any indication, they cannot wait to be done with Garlemald's involvement in the plot.

No Larsa to lead the empire into brighter days like back in FFXII's ending, just the same stale preaching.

I'll preface by saying I have a hearty dislike of monarchies, and that a nation's people can never truly be "free" while denied basic democractic process. That being said...

I think it's especially important that Garlemald's "royal" family are relieved of their duty. Established scarcely more than sixty years ago, from the first, they were only ever intended as puppeteers to mastermind the manipulation of Garlemald into causing chaos and strife on the world stage, and exploiting the Garlean's previous sense of vulnerability to their own ends. Though they've enjoyed propserity under rule, Garlemald has never been "free"; they went from one form of subjugation to another, even if they weren't fully aware of it (though some clearly were.) For them to truly start anew and break away from their past, I think it better that their fate be placed truly, squarely in their own hands for the first time than those of another ruler, no matter how benevolent. They deserve that much, at least.

[Teraq]

if the role quest was any indication, they cannot wait to be done with Garlemald's involvement in the plot.

Endwalker really made me feel this way with Garlemald and Ascians both. Incidentally, both were my favorite aspects of the story, and neither were done justice now that it's all said and done. Garlemald was off-screened, and the Ascian plot transformed into the Emet-Selch plot – to hell with anyone that isn't Emet-Selch.

I feel like I missed commentary on the final role quest however, probably because I missed conversation by entirely forgetting it existed (look, it's not my fault, it didn't show up as blue on the map!). What were people's feelings on it? I appreciated finally getting some more Nero, his boot licking of Fourchenault was totally on point. On the other hand... poor Nerva, wow. The poster child for Garlemald being off-screened, isn't he? And the Moon? Frankly what I've seen of the Loporrits and Smileton does not inspire trust, at all. All I'm getting from this particular plot point is that it seriously brought down the chances for a Garlemald reconstruction...

[aveyond-dreams]

I'll preface by saying I have a hearty dislike of monarchies, and that a nation's people can never truly be "free" while denied basic democractic process. That being said...

I think it's especially important that Garlemald's "royal" family are relieved of their duty. Established scarcely more than sixty years ago, from the first, they were only ever intended as puppeteers to mastermind the manipulation of Garlemald into causing chaos and strife on the world stage, and exploiting the Garlean's previous sense of vulnerability to their own ends. Though they've enjoyed propserity under rule, Garlemald has never been "free"; they went from one form of subjugation to another, even if they weren't fully aware of it (though some clearly were.) For them to truly start anew and break away from their past, I think it better that their fate be placed truly, squarely in their own hands for the first time than those of another ruler, no matter how benevolent. They deserve that much, at least.

That's great and all but we are talking about a fictional fantasy world, not real life. Even then under the so called "democracies" upward mobility and true freedom is impossible seeing as how the population of FFXIV's world is in a medieval state where literacy and access to higher education is extremely scarce. In any case, the Garlean monarchy still represented the best interests of Garlemald despite the underlying motives and under Solus they knew the most competent government they ever had, with the crowning achievement of previous regimes being the forced retreat all the way into a frozen wasteland.

A benevolent dictatorship (see: Larsa, Ashe, Garnet, etc) would be more beneficial for them and make for a more interesting world than the continued preaching of real world values into the game's world. Do you really think that the senate members just magically turned good after the fall of the empire? They probably still harbor nationalistic motives and other values you disagree with. Evil works best in packs, not as individuals. However, put the power in the hands of someone who leans more benevolent and things just might actually improve. However it's not like we'll see the senate members or the mythical Larsa anyway. Too hard to write, give new Taco Bell scene in 6.2 instead plz

[Theodric]

I suspect many of those drawn to Garlemald, however, do not have an aversion to the concept of a monarchy. To say nothing of the simple fact that any other system of rule is beholden to its own set of problems - often with far less accountability than the system they are supposedly replacing. It's not like the class divide is removed - for all the talk of everyone being 'equal' it's Lyse eating the finest food and drink in Ala Mhigo's palace whereas the everyman sits in grim little villages working themselves half to death.

There's also the simple fact that many of us live in countries with a rich history that we would like to see positively portrayed in fantasy video games where such aesthetics blend with the genre rather readily.

I'm not hugely interested in modern day takes and ideals being copied and pasted into fiction. To me that makes for a very bland experience overall.

As an aside, it was but recently that the Queen's Jubilee was celebrated here in the UK. Some people joined in with the festivities, some didn't - but there's enough support for the monarchy that it isn't likely to go anywhere anytime soon.