What's the point with that quite lackluster story in Endwalker?

[CrownySuccubus]

Regarding Magnai being characterised as 'creepy' within his own culture, would someone jog my memory as to what's being referenced here? Genuine question as I've forgotten the ins and outs of that. That being said, the Steppes are not exactly the pinnacle of refined behaviour to begin with, and far worse goes on there than some advances he makes to women which he never forces himself upon. He is a tribal warlord at the end of the day and his demeanour and mentality fit with that to the degree the story allows it to. Y'shtola even remarked on his advances as better than most she's been on the receiving end of.

Magnai's behavior basically comes across as the equivalent of cat-calling. While he isn't portrayed as particularly predatory, the "joke" is that his advances are almost always completely out of nowhere or out of context, and the woman he is hitting on has zero interest in that at the moment. Not unlike, say, a waitress getting hit on while she's trying to do her job or a woman getting whistled at while walking down the street. Not all that aggressive, compared to some of the worst behavior, but the general reaction to it is "WTF?" at worst and "Uhhh...thanks but no thanks" at best.

I don't remember exactly the line, but I do recall optional dialogue with either Cirina or Sadu where they say that female Xaela much prefer spending time with Sadu and Cirina than Magnai because he makes them uncomfortable.

And....how is this any different than how many people view Graha?

("than how a handful of people view Graha")

Anyway:

MAGNAI: "I am the sun! See how great I am!? Oh, and will you become my Nhaama?!"

G'RAHA: "Hey, if it's not too much trouble...and if it is, I'll completely understand...but would you mind taking me on your next adventure?"

Yep. Completely the same.

(INCIDENTALLY, I'm out of daily posts....so see you guys manana.)

EDIT: Nevermind. Guess we're doing this now.

Of course, there's the other side to Magnai which I, and many other men, can somewhat empathize with. Men are expected in society at large to make advances on women. Most of us are bad at it, because it's a pretty difficult thing to do. Most women will never know what it's like to make advances on someone, because they aren't expected to, and largely do not have too. Yet, in spite of this, they criticize every man's approach that does not make them feel at ease, often drawing on lived experience to designate an approach as cringe, unwanted, unwarranted, and whatever other words you wanna add that are synonymous with, "Don't, you shouldn't have, terrible."

I don't really have the time or desire to unpack ALL of this, but the primary difference between male and female flirtation comes down to sense of danger. Most men (especially tough Alpha Male guys) don't feel at all physically threatened by a woman that flirts with them, and even if they did, wouldn't want to admit it. Women, on the other hand, are not only taught to fear men (by both women AND men themselves), but it's also common for guys to see even the slightest positive reaction as an invitation to flirt more. They aren't specifically to blame for this -- it is legitimately hard to pick up signals -- but the risk of getting these signals wrong is not worth the risk of a guy believing he has a shot when that wasn't your intention, and then feel like you were "leading him on" when you're forced to say you aren't interested. So, for these complicated reasons (amongst other ones that, as I said, I'm not going unpack today), women just avoid directly asking someone out.

In regards to Magnai, he has another problem. Magnai has a bit of an ego problem, and the women of the Steppe don't seem to be into that. Magnai typically revels in flaunting his status and physical might to a religious extreme, and thus any woman who is either A) not privy to the same faith or B) uncomfortable with "preening" don't like it. Or, in the case of Cirina and Y'shtola, both. Magnai's joke is that he's only Foreveralone because he makes terrible first impressions, and he just doesn't GET that.

And how is this any different from how Graha acts with us? Its how many people myself included perceive him.

The short answer is that G'raha is extremely humble about how he approaches and asks you and, likewise, doesn't actually expect you to say "yes". While the game's "sin" is not actually giving the player the option to say no, G'raha is very softspoken. And all of this is just ask to tagalong on an adventure. Magnai, meanwhile, usually preambles his approaches with monlogues about destiny and the sun, already making the situation awkward before he basically proposes marriage.

There's ALSO the fact that G'raha is already the WOL's friend. (Okay, sure, maybe not YOUR WOL...but again, you have no choice with pretty much anybody, let alone G'raha.) G'raha isn't some complete stranger walking up and asking if you're their soulmate....which is what Magnai does. As I said above, Magnai's biggest problem (with the joke being that he doesn't get it) is terrible first impressions.

I dont think its fair to just downplay it as a "handful of people."

Whatever. I'm no longer in debating the semantical doublespeak between "Fan favorite character" and an opposing minority.

I also dont see how what Magnai does is catcalling...he isnt approaching every single woman on the steppes to be his nhamma

And another joke is actually that he might have done just that. We're flat out told that he's made a number of women on the Steppe uncomfortable, and the first thing he asks about whenever he talks to you about some new land is whether there's women there. The joke implies that he actually DOES hit on anywhere between 50 - 75% of the women he comes across. Which is another reason he leaves a bad impression.

and those he does approach, he takes no for an answer. Unlike Graha where we dont have that option, it feels gross.

Okay.

I guess we'll keep waiting for the option to dismiss party members.