Just Another Housing Complaint

[Jojoya]

Every player that acquired a house agreed to it being demolished if it wasn't being used.
So no one has any reason to be angry over it.

I certainly wasn't angry when they demolished mine, when I took a break from the game.

That's not what I was referring to.

I was talking about players who are asking for the houses of other players to be demolished so they have a chance to get the house themselves - then they still don't have the house because someone else wins it in the lottery. Are they going to be angry that houses being demolished didn't result in their getting a house? Of course they will be.

I've had a house demolished in the past as well (start of Stormblood). My break from the game was not planned but I knew what the result would be. I was fine with someone else getting a chance at a house while I was unable to play. I didn't enjoy having to wait 5 months after I returned to get another house but that wasn't the fault of the player who got my house.

That was SE's fault for designing a bad system.

[Silverbane]

That's not what I was referring to. I was talking about players who are asking for the houses of other players to be demolished so they have a chance to get the house themselves - then they still don't have the house because someone else wins it in the lottery. Are they going to be angry that houses being demolished didn't result in their getting a house? Of course they will be.

There is no "of course" about it. You're just slandering people you disagree with.

That was SE's fault for designing a bad system.

Feel free to not play.

Personal housing is a glamour mini-game with no impact on the rest of the game.
People who want instanced housing should realize almost no one will ever see your house in such a system.
That's how it was with SWTOR instanced housing.
BTDT, didn't seem worth the effort.

[Divinemights]

I've already covered the myopic points in this post. Please feel encouraged to read a thread before jumping in on page 7.

Yes, the reason you gave doesn't change the fact you didn't put in effort and just blankly saying you have tried it.
I help my friend who joined 3.0 (who genuinely start fresh) obtained a goblet small then later move to Shirogane with me as neighbors.
If my friends who joined 5.0 is able to obtain plots during last Shirogane (who are also start fresh and Shirogane was the only option)
I don't see why your complaint has any solid ground as a "legacy player"

[Fybrile]

you didn't put in effort

To repeat myself:

1. You don't know me. You have no idea how much effort I've put into getting a house. This makes your accusations based on pretentiousness or ignorance. Perhaps both.
2. Who crowned you judge and jury about how much effort is required to get some pixels in a video game I've sunk over a thousand dollars into? Get off that high horse.
3. You - and people like you - keep using your own experiences as evidence of how I'm wrong. That's a fallacy. It's pretty small brain to assume everyone's experiences are the same.
4. In a zero-sum system like this, you and your friends having a house isn't proof of how I should have a house. It's part of the reason I don't. Thus, it's a pretty bad example to use.
5. My complaint is based on a veritable mountain of solid ground. You can tell by the fact nearly every single thread in this subforum is repeating it. Since 2014. If you want to plug your ears and stick your head in the sand about this clear problem with the game, I'd suggest avoiding the Housing subforum altogether, cuz that's just about all you're going to read here.

What your posts seek to do is delegitimize or silence me because you don't like what I have to say. You apparently can't imagine how someone could play this game from 1.0 and not have a house. You can't imagine it, because you either don't have the correct information or refuse to acknowledge it. That lack of imagination and information is called ignorance. You shouldn't base opinions on ignorance.

[Fybrile]

Feel free to not play.

This is the quintessential dismissive response. I get that you're frustrated by posts you disagree with, but you could just elect to not respond rather than degrade the discussion to back-and-forth vitriol.

Personal housing is a glamour mini-game with no impact on the rest of the game.

Well, that's not exactly true. There's having a chocobo stable, a garden, and a cheap teleport point close to one of the major cities. These have an impact upon the rest of the game. Not to mention the fact that having an impact on the rest of the game isn't a prerequisite for importance to players. I mean, aesthetics and displaying your loot and achievements are a known and popular part of playing an MMORPG. Just because it's decorative in nature, doesn't make it of lesser importance.

PVP has minimal impact on the rest of the game beyond farming tokens in the DF and some glamour gear, but I don't think one would try to make the claim not every player is entitled to access it. That's a strange double standard.

People who want instanced housing should realize almost no one will ever see your house in such a system.

I don't think most of us care about this. If I want you to check out my house, I'm more than happy to post pics on Discord.


It's just so strange to me how some vocal minority of players want to act as gatekeepers for this supposedly tertiary content. They're so desperate to protect it's irrational, indefensible rarity, while at the same time trying to convince those who can't participate that the content is unimportant or insignificant. It's as if the cost of the extra servers is going to come out of their pockets.

At least have the balls to be honest and say how you really feel - that you appreciate your house more because of its artificial rarity, and want to pay forward all the difficulty you experienced in order to get it. Or, that you got your house super easy, and can't relate. Either position sounds a lot of "Nya nana nana naaa!" to me.

To slightly modify the very motto of this game:
"To ignore the plight of those one might conceivably help is not wisdom - it's indolence."

You should be standing with us on this. All players should have a reasonable chance to access all the content of this game.

[Jojoya]

There is no "of course" about it. You're just slandering people you disagree with.

Where's the slander?

Feel free to not play.

Why would I stop playing when I have a house and I'm enjoying the game?

What I'm looking for is SE to fix the system so one player owning a house, or even multiple houses, will not prevent other players who want a house from getting one. I want everyone to be able to enjoy housing to its fullest extent if that is what they want without being subject to gatekeeping by other players.

Personal housing is a glamour mini-game with no impact on the rest of the game.

What does that have to do with anything? It's still game content that player would like to enjoy.

People who want instanced housing should realize almost no one will ever see your house in such a system.
That's how it was with SWTOR instanced housing.
BTDT, didn't seem worth the effort.

So your entire experience with instanced housing was SWTOR?

Try RIFT and experience their Dimensions. That's a fully instanced housing system. How do we know that other players are frequently seeing housing? Because there is a Like system for Dimensions. If you enable your Dimension for public viewing, the number of likes it has will appear in the search listing. There are Dimensions with hundreds or even thousands of likes. It had a lot of other features that players ask for here but this game lacks. Just a shame the rest of the game isn't on the same level as the housing.

What's not worth the effort to you may very much be worth the effort to others.

[Divinemights]

I am unable to see any reason to bring up system from dead mmorpg.
The games didn’t survive because of its housing system only shows housing system is a flavor to have but not a necessity.
Even Skyrim Online is still alive, it’s so called housing system got nothing to attract me to play the game.
Every game has their own signature feature and this Ward system is rightly FF14’s

If everyone is going to design a system same way, didn’t we also how that idea failed miserably.
Elden ring slapped, spitted, and stomped every single rpg maker’s face is the best proof.

[Silverbane]

Try RIFT and experience their Dimensions. That's a fully instanced housing system. How do we know that other players are frequently seeing housing? Because there is a Like system for Dimensions. If you enable your Dimension for public viewing, the number of likes it has will appear in the search listing. There are Dimensions with hundreds or even thousands of likes.

Is there also non-instanced neighborhood housing like here in Rift?

I ask because I see no chance at all of SE getting rid of the current (non-instanced) neighborhood houses .

Rare mounts are desired for only one reason: they are hard to get.
Housing is no different, and easy-to-get houses will always be devalued as long as hard-to-get neighborhood houses are in the game. As a result, the continued existence of the neighborhood houses will make instanced housis seem second-rate by comparison -- just like apartments seem to be viewed now.

They gave us apartments, and the housing malcontents spurned the apartments. Instanced houses are not much more than bigger apartments; there is no reason to think the malcontents won't spurn them, too, once they realize how much more prestigious and desirable the neighborhood houses are. Many will just declare "I don't want it" and demand more neighborhood houses.

Therefore, instanced houses will not end the salt, and I think SE understand that.
If they do, they won't waste resources implementing it.

[Fybrile]

Quote goes here.

Why do you willfully ignore what people are saying?

Is it because you don't have a good retort?

You keep shifting the goalposts in your argument every time your points are dismantled rather than acknowledging your bias.

Most of your arguments are based on the logic that simply because you proclaim something as imperatively and abrasively as you can, that makes it true. It doesn't.

For example, housing is a system. Not a thing. So, in this case, having a house is not comparable to having a rare mount. That's a false equivalency. As a system, it would have to be compared to a mount system in general.

Mounts in general are not desirable because of their rarity. They're common, expected features of a modern MMO. Especially one that is making obscene amounts of money, veritable bucketloads of cash, from their playerbase monthly. Perhaps having a large house is comparable to having a rare mount. Okay. But, that makes having a small house comparable to having a mount at all.

Why apartments aren't the same as a house has been covered ad nauseum in this and other threads. You are blatantly ignoring those valid points, likely because you don't any way to invalidate them.

To label everyone who complains about the woefully inadequate housing in FFXIV as "malcontents" is dismissive and, frankly, your posts and your points seem to suggest you're smarter than to stoop to such base prejudice and namecalling. I, for example, complain about housing vocally, but am certainly not a malcontent. I've fanboyed this game for over a decade now. Even flew to Japan to check out the Eorzea Cafe. Twice. Not the actions of a malcontent my friend.

When it comes to housing, I'm just telling it like it is. Most players, even ones who have a house, genuinely think the system sucks. But, more importantly, you shouldn't be trying to gatekeep what is and isn't a problem for people. While Jojoya often corrects the factual inaccuracies in a post, you seem to be mad just because people don't value things the way you think they should. That's what we would call "pedantic". It's not cool to be pedantic.

You're not going to change minds by beating the apartments dead horse. We've explained how they're inadequate ad nauseum. And you're certainly not going to change minds by being rude and pretentious. That's just going to entrench people and make this a toxic environment, which hopefully you don't want either.

A good place to start would be to read the points against apartments, trying to understand them, and then explaining why you think having them precludes SE from adding more houses. Why there's even a relationship there. To use your own rarity examples, just because SE adds a bunch of grey weapons to the game, that doesn't mean we're good. We all expect to get green, blue and purples. So why, in this instance, is it enough for SE to add greys only?

And, most importantly, why do you think everyone but you and your small clique should be happy with greys?

[Silverbane]

Ranting and personal attacks deleted

What a bunch of BS.

Fybrile entire post is just insult, rants, and cloaked references to supposed arguments he can't make himself and can't provide links to.
I'm always amused when people claim "we refuted that argument" but never provide a pointer to when or where.

And Fybrile is apparently too ignorant of how software is developed and works to realize that adding multiple different housing systems is far more difficult than having weapons be different colors.

The fact the FC housing didn't make the current housing malcontents happy, adding personal houses didn't make them happy, and then adding apartments didn't make them happy should give SE pause before thinking adding yet another version of housing will make the malcontents happy.

In the end, if SE even bothers to consider yet-another-kind-of-housing in the face of this history, SE will do what any profit-oriented company would do: estimate how many new subscribers they would gain as a result of adding a feature, estimate how many they will lose as a result of not adding it, estimate the cost in terms of software development, software maintenance, and additional hardware required, and then decide whether the feature is worth the effort.

In that analysis, anything but incremental changes (like adding a Thavnarian housing district) are unlikely to happen.