Action condensing options

[Rowde]

I've always been for this as a controller player

on a controller setup real estate is even more prime since face buttons (circle square triangle x) and directional buttons have to be considered differently
face buttons are easier to press through movement mechanics so they are the most prime real estate on hotbars and since the 123 combos often need to be maintained through movement that means they pretty much have to live there

having the option to condense the 123 into a combo would allow me to free up at least two buttons on the face buttons for most jobs which would then allow me to put the most often pressed weaves on to face buttons in the same section so it would be easier to press weaves through movement

[LeonKeyh]

Is it, though? It's an additional layer of execution, that while simple, has been a fundamental part of the 'feel' of this game for a long time. You could argue most mechanics in games are arbitrary.

Seems likely that will be the next argument.

Fact of the matter is 1-2-3 is much more complex than 1-1-1. Even if people with.... a certain amount of brain capacity don't think that's the case. It's the whole "rub your stomach and pat your head"; neither of those actions are difficult, but whenever doing them at the same time it becomes tougher than the sum of the tasks. 1-1-1 is the equivalent of "pat your head and your stomach" and 1-2-3 is "Pat your head and rub your stomach"

[KizuyaKatogami]

Clear the savage fights and then make that statement.

Hi, i’ve cleared savage from Eden to Pandaemonium. This game is already “roll my face and get rewards.” I main healer and i literally get clears just by spamming a single button for 90% of the fight. I agree with the Brokentooth’s statement 1000%.

[Raoabolic]

Considering devs have kneecapped middlecore content's difficulty then they might as well add this feature as well. All I can say is if you are playing XIV for it's difficulty then you are around 6 to 7 years too late, lol.

[hagare]

Seems likely that will be the next argument.

Fact of the matter is 1-2-3 is much more complex than 1-1-1. Even if people with.... a certain amount of brain capacity don't think that's the case. It's the whole "rub your stomach and pat your head"; neither of those actions are difficult, but whenever doing them at the same time it becomes tougher than the sum of the tasks. 1-1-1 is the equivalent of "pat your head and your stomach" and 1-2-3 is "Pat your head and rub your stomach"

I guess I'll wait for another kaiten removal

[Lauront]

Perfectly fine with it if it is introduced as an option and is reserved as such.

[Kolsykol]

I'd rather not have more 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 1 in the game plz.

Seems likely that will be the next argument.

Fact of the matter is 1-2-3 is much more complex than 1-1-1. Even if people with.... a certain amount of brain capacity don't think that's the case. It's the whole "rub your stomach and pat your head"; neither of those actions are difficult, but whenever doing them at the same time it becomes tougher than the sum of the tasks. 1-1-1 is the equivalent of "pat your head and your stomach" and 1-2-3 is "Pat your head and rub your stomach"

You're not wrong, altho some people will say that you are.
It's just objectively true that 1 2 3 is more complex and difficult than 1 1 1.
That doesn't mean it's a super huge difference, but pressing three different buttons is harder and more complex than pressing one button three times yeah...

It's just kind of a silly thing to try and argue against, it's pretty self-evident.

[RitsukoSonoda]

And what about jobs that aren't just 1-2-3 combo rotations... like most DPS? Or are you advocating removal of numerous other skills from jobs to dumb them down to only having to press 1-2-3 then turn it into 1-1-1?

[Lauront]

They are solely talking about abilities that have chained combos, and these inherently end up taking up more space. Try any melee dps or tank in PVP mode and you will see what they mean. Again, the OP put this forward as an optional thing. I would not use it. Many wouldn't. But it'd be nice as an option for those complaining about lack of button space etc. like Rowde above. With that said, I also like the suggestion Leon had about an AOE type stance. Not that it need be mutually exclusive, but there's non-combo using jobs which also utilise a lot of button space, so that would be beneficial there. Their design is just not very economical in some cases, where it could be.

[BrokentoothMarch]

Is it, though? It's an additional layer of execution, that while simple, has been a fundamental part of the 'feel' of this game for a long time. You could argue most mechanics in games are arbitrary.

An additional layer of execution being condensed to little more than "press next number" is hardly some intense thought.

An actual layer of execution would require more reactive responses. An enemy is casting X, however, if they are casting something else, Y is the better option. I must keep Z up now before the next phase, as I will not be able to reapply Z come that moment. There are extremely few, if any, moments like that in this game. It's pretty much avoid the scary orange bits or memorize the difference between a regular attack or a lateral attack while consistently pressing 1-2-3. The combat in GW2 for example, is extremely impactful if at the price of extremely little button variety. The compensation comes from the enemy designs. However, XIV suffers from having the penalty of such little buttons as GW2 while claiming button bloat as complexity while, well, we do little else than damage go up.

Naturally it wasn't always this way even in XIV. The game back then had far more emphasis on DoTs and status effects, with even some of the earlier heal quests putting an emphasis on your ability to use Sleep to deaggro, to say nothing of the reactive nature, as I mentioned just now, of things like Cleric Stance. Was Cleric Stance perfect? Furthest thing from, but it was on the right path, I believe. However, the devs have continuously shown that instead of refinement or expansion, they'd rather cut the whole thing off for the sake of more streamlining. They claim it as accessibility, but I doubt even that excuse. I truly think that we're seeing more and more days where the game gets reduced developer attention. By homogenizing and making many a button less impactful, it makes streamlining balancing far easier due to the condensing of the buttons and their effects.

This is why I often say this game is complex in name only. Aside from many a button, there's not much behind it. And, again, there are some buttons that simply have no business not being collapsible. I once again bring up Ikushoten and Ogi Namikiri, which are buttons that are intrinsically tied (You literally cannot cast Namikiri without Ikushoten) yet are two different buttons. This is hardly complex, but instead just tedium pretending to be complexity.

Insipidness 1

Insipidness 2

Both of you can cope about how it's more complex to press a button with the label 2 over it rather than 1 all you want, but it doesn't make things any more deep. If you truly are going to tell me that complexity is something we were all taught in pre-school, then what a pathetic bar to pass and I have no need to discuss with either of you. Cute callback to my comment on brain capacity, Leon, but it falls short when your point is "haha 123 hard 111 no hard haha".

Also, Kol, that mask looks like garbage. You look better without it. Though I suppose about as much an improvement as 1-2-3 is over 1-1-1.