Has anyone quit healing?

[ThorneDynasty]

Gotta love every time someone brings up the creativity in PvP mode, someone else just has to spring up to "educate" everyone how PvE works differently and you can't just transfer kits 1:1. Because the first person totally didn't understand that.

[Risvertasashi]

Gotta love people that miss the entire point of a post.

I never said the kits could, or couldn't, transfer 1:1. I'm saying that certain concepts don't work the way PvE is designed in this game with its heavily scripted boss fights. (Things like heavy-CC kits could work if FF14 were, say, a horde fighter. Or a MOBA. lol).

Sure, maybe throw in a gap closer and a beam that won't be nearly as impactful as PvP but if people just want the visual spectacle and won't mind it being a wet noodle that doesn't do much in PvE then, more power to them...

I do agree that in general, DPS kits in PvE could use more variety - but that's independent of PvP. As for one ability proccing another, that's been tried in PvE in the past and was not received well, but I suppose there's always a chance the next time could be different...

[rewd]

Gotta love people that miss the entire point of a post.

I never said the kits could, or couldn't, transfer 1:1. I'm saying that certain concepts don't work the way PvE is designed in this game with its heavily scripted boss fights. (Things like heavy-CC kits could work if FF14 were, say, a horde fighter. Or a MOBA. lol).

Sure, maybe throw in a gap closer and a beam that won't be nearly as impactful as PvP but if people just want the visual spectacle and won't mind it being a wet noodle that doesn't do much in PvE then, more power to them...

I do agree that in general, DPS kits in PvE could use more variety - but that's independent of PvP. As for one ability proccing another, that's been tried in PvE in the past and was not received well, but I suppose there's always a chance the next time could be different...

It's not that people miss the point, it's just that you refuse to elaborate.

You said that PvP healers aren't healers but we don't know why. You said that PvE healer can't go in the same directions as PvP healers but you barely talked about those directions. PvP CC can't be brought over to PvE. You are right, cool. Who even asked that?

We want fun skills. Interactions. Less bloated kits. DPS and healing being connected. PvP has all of this and there is a lot PvE can learn from it. PvP gave every healers a different identity and PvE can easily do the same.

You just cherry picked one aspect of PvP that wouldn't work in PvE, pretended it's what people want to see in PvE and called it a day. I showed you how healer design can learn from PvP and you shrugged it all off by trying to make it look like it's just about animations and visual spectacle even though I have never mentioned any of that but focused on effects and interactions instead.

[Risvertasashi]

It's not that people miss the point, it's just that you refuse to elaborate.

You said that PvP healers aren't healers but we don't know why. You said that PvE healer can't go in the same directions as PvP healers but you barely talked about those directions. PvP CC can't be brought over to PvE. You are right, cool. Who even asked that?

We want fun skills. Interactions. Less bloated kits. DPS and healing being connected. PvP has all of this and there is a lot PvE can learn from it. PvP gave every healers a different identity and PvE can easily do the same.

You just cherry picked one aspect of PvP that wouldn't work in PvE, pretended it's what people want to see in PvE and called it a day. I showed you how healer design can learn from PvP and you shrugged it all off by trying to make it look like it's just about animations and visual spectacle even though I have never mentioned any of that but focused on effects and interactions instead.

I was responding to ThorneDynasty. I don't particularly disagree with your points.

I guess the only thing I'd add is if SE does add procs/combos, I don't think it should mix healing and damage - in PVE, those sorts of abilities only end up getting used for damage or if a situation ends up pressuring them to hold it, people tend to hate taking a DPS loss for it. But the main difficulty is just convincing SE to increase DPS complexity and if you can do that, you don't need to take stuff from PVP that would feel bad in PVE - like combining a gap closer, damage move, and healing move.

[ThorneDynasty]

I was responding to ThorneDynasty.

Yes, they know. Your post was still badly explained.

And then you go into 1:1 interpretation to explain why things just can't work anway? Like damage to healing is the easiest thing to adjust for PvE. Add stacks.

Or more ideally, instead of having 5 free redundant cooldown heals, they could tighten the kit to the point where not being smart with Assize/Earthly Star just means you'll lose the DPS gain from having to rely on GCD healing later. Never going to happen in this game, but ideally.

[Lazariah]

OP, I went through what you did to a degree. I've mained Scholar since sometime in ARR when I joined (started as CNJ then quickly went to SCH when I found out it existed) Shadowbringers was a VERY heavy hit to my love for the class. I still mained it then, mostly out of spite. But it wasn't as fun as it used to be. And it continued to get less and less fun for me. So when Endwalker came out I went to SGE. I found SGE fun and reminiscent of what SCH used to be. So with my static I raided as SGE for a while.

But I recently changed to AST. I needed well...something else to do other then press 1 constantly. As soon as my static got used to a fight I could literally fall asleep and let muscle memory take over. It's an over all MASSIVE flaw with how FFXIV handles healers in general right now. But at least with AST I'd be learning something new and have cards to keep me busy.

If it were not for my static, I would have swapped to BRD. I still do roulettes as BRD. I only heal when I am with my static. All other content? BRD. Well, except PvP where playing healers is actually FUN. So I am a healer main still but the vast majority of content in game I am not. And it feels bad. My whole identity as a gamer is being a healer or support role. I do it in every game I play that has those roles. It just feels really weird that this is where we are at in regards to healing in FFXIV.

[Liam_Harper]

Balance is absolutely a detriment to the game.
Meta slaves loose their collective shit if their favourite job is like x% below some else's. Or they operate under the assumption that everyone plays perfectly therefore you don't need [x] ability. Now all we have left is [increase DPS by x%].

It's nothing to do with meta slaves. I love optimization, min maxing and generally lean towards the better classes but I agree this game is overbalanced. I want to be able to do fun crazy things from time to time. Especially when it's fun crazy things that require you play well and reward you for using your toolkit intelligently.

It's generally more often the casual players who shout for balance the loudest. The players who barely stepped foot in Savage demanding Astrodyne nerfs or the players who don't even play tank demanding WAR nerfs because of dungeons of all things. But to be honest, I'm not attacking casuals, I think players really need to stop blaming each other for how the game is instead of the developers who are selling us a product and are meant to be the professionals at making games. We don't make the game. We certainly don't put a gun to Yoshida's head and force him to make changes that make the game worse. If a game developer is unable to determine good feedback from bad and make a high quality product, they shouldn't be in the business. It's on them.

[ty_taurus]

It's nothing to do with meta slaves. I love optimization, min maxing and generally lean towards the better classes but I agree this game is overbalanced. I want to be able to do fun crazy things from time to time. Especially when it's fun crazy things that require you play well and reward you for using your toolkit intelligently.

It's generally more often the casual players who shout for balance the loudest. The players who barely stepped foot in Savage demanding Astrodyne nerfs or the players who don't even play tank demanding WAR nerfs because of dungeons of all things. But to be honest, I'm not attacking casuals, I think players really need to stop blaming each other for how the game is instead of the developers who are selling us a product and are meant to be the professionals at making games. We don't make the game. We certainly don't put a gun to Yoshida's head and force him to make changes that make the game worse. If a game developer is unable to determine good feedback from bad and make a high quality product, they shouldn't be in the business. It's on them.

To add a bit, I do think our community as a whole does have an unhealthy obsession with balance. Food is good and an important part of our lives, but becoming obsessed with food can lead to an unhealthy relationship with it. Game balance is much the same. It's important to have a strong balance, but becoming obsessed with attaining perfection largely means sacrificing things that have made jobs unique in the past.

[Semirhage]

To add a bit, I do think our community as a whole does have an unhealthy obsession with balance. Food is good and an important part of our lives, but becoming obsessed with food can lead to an unhealthy relationship with it. Game balance is much the same. It's important to have a strong balance, but becoming obsessed with attaining perfection largely means sacrificing things that have made jobs unique in the past.

My one sticking point with (lack of) balance is when said lack of balance always goes in favor of specific jobs, and never in favor of another. *cough cough* WHM always blowing chunks and AST/SCH getting unique tools that let it clown all over their competition, locking the role into a stagnant obvious meta that never changes.

[KikiTia]

As someone who has been healing almost entirely since... late Stormblood? I'd say that at this point it's less about class fantasy and more just enjoying healing. I'll admit I only really play AST because it's a lot more flavorful and interesting than the other healers because of how cards and seals work. But honestly I don't care a whole lot for any of the class design, I just like healing. If I could choose I would much rather a dark-themed healer or a eastern paint-themed healer, and from a roleplay perspective I get a lot more joy out of something like PLD or RPR. I might suggest tanking or support dps if you want to still have a meaningful role, but yeah healing could use a bit more love and attention compared to other roles. However I do not think any of them are unplayable like some do, I just think they're a bit plain and repetitive compared to many of the other more unique and intricate class designs in the game.