Results 1 to 10 of 255

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    Player
    ForteNightshade's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2013
    Location
    Limsa Lominsa
    Posts
    3,648
    Character
    Kurenai Tenshi
    World
    Cactuar
    Main Class
    Paladin Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Kenky View Post
    Like the one person who actively data-mined and found the "hidden" mechanics in the DSR fight. Then strapped that to a bot to get it to play audio ques when said hidden mechanics come out, actively changing the fight by giving a tell when you shouldn't be getting one.
    I assume you meant TEA because this never happened with Dragonsong. Granted, it didn't with TEA either but at least the accusations were present. In both fights, people datamined the debuffs, which offers nothing more than an icon. They didn't make triggers based on any of these datamines because that isn't how triggers work. ACT straight up doesn't even function whenever new battle content releases, including Ultimate. Secondly, they can't make a trigger without know precisely what the game is relaying from the server. This necessitates actually seeing the mechanic themselves and performing it. The sole exception would be simple things like "in/out". Even then, you still need the aforementioned code due to say, Gnashing and Lash being different than Dyanmo and Chariot. At least in terms of how you'd write a trigger for it.

    People who have absolutely no idea how these programs work should really stop talking about them. If you want to criticise their existence or what have you, by all means. That's entirely fair game. Just stop making wild assumptions on their functionality.
    (5)
    "Stand in the ashes of a trillion dead souls and ask the ghosts if honor matters."
    "The silence is your answer."


  2. #2
    Player
    Kenky's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Location
    Ul'dah
    Posts
    380
    Character
    R'ahlin Taka
    World
    Mateus
    Main Class
    Monk Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by ForteNightshade View Post
    I assume you meant TEA because this never happened with Dragonsong. Granted, it didn't with TEA either but at least the accusations were present. In both fights, people datamined the debuffs, which offers nothing more than an icon. They didn't make triggers based on any of these datamines because that isn't how triggers work. ACT straight up doesn't even function whenever new battle content releases, including Ultimate. Secondly, they can't make a trigger without know precisely what the game is relaying from the server. This necessitates actually seeing the mechanic themselves and performing it. The sole exception would be simple things like "in/out". Even then, you still need the aforementioned code due to say, Gnashing and Lash being different than Dyanmo and Chariot. At least in terms of how you'd write a trigger for it.

    People who have absolutely no idea how these programs work should really stop talking about them. If you want to criticise their existence or what have you, by all means. That's entirely fair game. Just stop making wild assumptions on their functionality.

    Then do -YOU- know why there were audio ques playing on certain people streams despite not being part of the fight? Seems pretty suspect. I will admit I don't know much about ACT myself, outside of it being a "damage meter" of sorts. But the fact it interacts with game information makes it punishable to use. While ACT itself may not have been the most "serious" of 3rd-party assistance.

    The audio-ques played through a bot (which can be done. Plenty of people have done it prior with look-away mechanics as early as ARR) is certainly crossing the line, despite it being nothing more than another indicator of "Do the Mechanic." Your claim that 'People dont know until they do the fight' is ignoring the people who actively cracked into the files to find the strings.

    Square Enix brought attention to this in their response. Actively calling out Dataminers. They wouldn't do that if there was no reason to.

    3rd-party tools that interact with the game is a no-no. SE has shown to be "don't show, don't tell." If you don't broadcast that you're going against ToS, SE has no reason to investigate. But Streamers actively show they are violating ToS by being live. As such, people will definitely report them and SE will be required to investigate. This is how this entire thing blew up. The amount of people claiming SE is changing its rules clearly didn't read the ToS themselves.

    And lastly, before anyone decides to claim they need ACT for whatever reason, you don't. You really don't. All of the defenses for it (with the exception of self-improvement) is questionable at best. SE even created this weird place that has been around since Heavensward (I think?) called Stone, Sea and Sky. Y'know. The place where you can go and practice against a target that performs some of the mechanics in the fight, while also seeing if you can reach enough personal DPS to pass.
    (1)
    Last edited by Kenky; 05-13-2022 at 09:28 AM.

  3. #3
    Player
    JudgeRAW's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2019
    Posts
    32
    Character
    Bladelord Rictr
    World
    Famfrit
    Main Class
    Red Mage Lv 100
    Quote Originally Posted by Kenky View Post
    words
    SSS is literally a target dummy. it does not allow you to practice any mechanics, whatsoever. It is also a poor indication of the DPS required since many have been proven to be either UNDERTUNED or OVERTUNED for different jobs, and they don't take raid buffs into consideration which is important for certain jobs (like DNC.) The only thing dataminers leak are models of things to come in the game and maybe debuff symbol. That was even cited in the letter by YoshiP. You literally cannot datamine mechanics because they are not included in the game data installed on someone's system.

    No one would ever claim a parser is needed to play the game, or any game. But you remember how YoshiP said recently that higher skilled players should be more willing to help lower skilled players clear hard content? How do you think the higher skilled players got to be as good as they are? What allowed them to see the nuances of their roles so they know better about when you use certain abilities, or when to save charges for raid buffs, or what is the optimal rotation to play the job? Unless you use a parser there is NO WAY in the game to know what damage you are doing. At all, period. Parsers allow players to compare their performance to someone else and improve their gameplay. That is the primary use of them. You don't have to use them, no one does, but not everyone is going to play for the same reasons you do. Some people actually value being good at the game, some people absolutely value beign the best and that is perfectly OK. The toxic part is when people tell them they are wrong for wanting to be better than everyone else, because there is nothign wrong with wanting to be good.
    (14)
    Last edited by JudgeRAW; 05-13-2022 at 10:14 AM.