Sage Needs More Options to Generate Addersting

[EhvaTaco]

My favorite part about discussing Sage is when I go to great lengths to discuss why Rhizomata should not generate Addersting only for someone to immediately say "Just give Rhizomata Addersting" as if my existence is a figment of my own imagination.

Oh, don't be such an Emet-Sulk. We got a vocal minority of SMN decriers for that.

Overall, here is my feedback:

• Rework Rhizomata so that it will gain Addersting instead of Addersgall
• Or gain Addersting after using a Addergall spell
• Or generate Addersting after the timer of Eukrasian Dosis III runs out

Rhizomata is typically best used to gain more Gall in tight spots. If anything, I think the cooldown should be doubled but have it grant 2 Gall or even 3 instead. However, a short cooldown with 1 Gall has its merit, too. Both have their ups and downs.

Gaining Sting after Gall is something I can totally agree with. Maybe not in a 1:1 ratio though but perhaps 1:2 or 1:3. Making SGE earn Stings through consistent use would feel more rewarding.

As for Dosis management... I don't think this is a good point. You never want your dots to run out. You want them to keep ticking continously without interrruption. BRDs and old SMN players will attest to that.

[AnotherPerson]

The biggest issue with Addersgall generating Addersting occurs regardless of whether or not the chance is 100% or less. It would be a DPS gain, which would be great on the gameplay feel of Addersting usage, but you'd be heavily incentivized to burn all your Addersting and Rhizomata exclusively for your 2 minute raid buffs. This would result in an excessive amount of overhealing during that time and a depletion of healing resources as well as would erase Rhizomata's current function in favor of being used on cooldown for DPS gains. Even if it's only a chance, you'd still burn all your Addersgall in hopes of generating Addersting during that window.

The solution here would be to allow addersgall to generate addersting (or even a fractional amount), but then add in a second addersting skill specifically for raid buffing and leave Toxikon as the same potency as Dosis to keep it DPS Neutral, yet flexible for weaving and mobility purposes. This implementation would however give a lot more weave windows and free mobility to Sage, but the exact amount of extra Toxikon uses can be adjusted based on the speed at which addersting generates.

At any rate, they might as well just remove the Ruin II restriction on Scholar and give AST more mobility with an instant-cast movement tool outside of lightspeed.

Just ideas to bounce around, seeing as healer gameplay is heavily restricted as a result of a lack of alternatives.

[ty_taurus]

The solution here would be to allow addersgall to generate addersting (or even a fractional amount), but then add in a second addersting skill specifically for raid buffing and leave Toxikon as the same potency as Dosis to keep it DPS Neutral, yet flexible for weaving and mobility purposes. This implementation would however give a lot more weave windows and free mobility to Sage, but the exact amount of extra Toxikon uses can be adjusted based on the speed at which addersting generates.

At any rate, they might as well just remove the Ruin II restriction on Scholar and give AST more mobility with an instant-cast movement tool outside of lightspeed.

Just ideas to bounce around, seeing as healer gameplay is heavily restricted as a result of a lack of alternatives.

Or just do what PvP does and have Toxikon I cost no addersting and be the ruin II people seem to want and upgrade it’s potency under addersting so that way it’s also an actually interesting gauge mechanic.

Having a gauge exclusively revolving around ruin II is just bad.

[WaxSw]

At this point Rhizomata giving addersting is the fix that sounds more realistic to me.

Personally, altough unlikely, I would like in the future to see much more of this mechanic like Eukrasian toxicon and toxicon working as a combo one powering the other and being dps gains when used like that, an ofensive cd that gives addersting on top doing more (an eukrasian like offensive combo is the idea that I think it would work the most), toxicon reducing the cd of other skills, creating a gauge that once filled gives addersting and requires offensive actions to be filled, Prognosis giving addersting like diagnosis (something as simple as "if the shield of someone under the effects of kardion is broken gives 1 addersting"), pepsis giving addersting if by breaking a shield fulfills the condition of said shields to give addersting even a cd that makes the gcd heals give 2 addersting instead of 1. They can really do a lot but I doubt we'll see any change until 7.0 at the earliest if we're lucky

[EaMett]

I personally think addersting works fine. There's literally no situation in the game right now where you don't have or can't generate enough of them. They should keep it as is. It gives people something to work towards and improve their skills on. And god knows healers don't have enough of that right now. Last thing we need is for SE to dumb down yet another healer mechanic.

[ty_taurus]

I personally think addersting works fine. There's literally no situation in the game right now where you don't have or can't generate enough of them. They should keep it as is. It gives people something to work towards and improve their skills on. And god knows healers don't have enough of that right now. Last thing we need is for SE to dumb down yet another healer mechanic.

I think you're thinking of Addersgall. Addersting is what gives you Ruin II

[EaMett]

I think you're thinking of Addersgall. Addersting is what gives you Ruin II

I'm talking about Addertsting. Toxicon II is a mobility tool and there's nothing wrong with it in its current implementation.

[ty_taurus]

I'm talking about Addertsting. Toxicon II is a mobility tool and there's nothing wrong with it in its current implementation.

But you regularly don't have Addersting and frequently have no way to generate it without losing DPS which counteracts your previous statement. But I veto that Ruin II is a singular entity worthy of a gauge mechanic. If that were the case, then ARR and HW SCH had multiple gauge worthy spells.

Literally just do this:

1. Remove Dyskrasia
2. Learn Toxikon at level 46
3. Toxikon: Potency upgrades with Dosis to always match. Deals full damage to the first target and 50% less for all remaining enemies. Costs 700 MP. Does not consume Addersting.
4. Learn Toxikon II at level 50
5. Toxikon II: Potency upgrades to be twice your current Dosis. Toxikon upgrades to Toxikon II when you have Addersting. Deals full damage to the first target and 50% less for all remaining enemies. Costs 0 MP. Consumes 1 Addersting.
6. When you cast Eukrasian Dosis, applies a buff to your Kardia target for 20 seconds. Casting Eukrasia Diagnosis or Eukrasia Prognosis on that target generates 1 Addersting and consumes that buff.

Now you get your Ruin II that also doubles as your AoE button. We prune 1 button off of Sage. Addersting becomes a more interesting mechanic. You can't spam Eukrasia Diagnosis for Addersting now as it's attached to your DoT.

Now look me in the eyes and tell me how much worse of a system that is then getting Ruin II whenever your Eukrasia Diagnosis barrier breaks.

[rewd]

I personally think addersting works fine. There's literally no situation in the game right now where you don't have or can't generate enough of them. They should keep it as is. It gives people something to work towards and improve their skills on. And god knows healers don't have enough of that right now. Last thing we need is for SE to dumb down yet another healer mechanic.

Since when is using a shield on someone "something to work towards" and "something to improve their skills on"? What work? What skills?

Addersting it's a waste of UI space, a mechanic completely dependent on fight downtime and essentially Ruin II with extra steps. It's not interesting, it's not complex, it doesn't interact with your healing kit in a way that suits the current healer design and your comment explained why very well. It just wasn't intentional.

[EaMett]

But you regularly don't have Addersting and frequently have no way to generate it without losing DPS which counteracts your previous statement.

You can handle all movement in every encounter so far with 3 start Adderstings and generating new ones during downtime.
If you find yourself needing more then there are areas you can improve on. And this isn't new to optimized strats or whatever else you can think of. This was true since week one of any of the encounters.

Since when is using a shield on someone "something to work towards" and "something to improve their skills on"? What work? What skills?

Getting the Addersting isn't particularly engaging (minus a couple of difficult downtime portions, and btw none of the suggestions made here change that either), but placement, slidecasting, and timing are skill-based and will prevent you from spending your Addersting and running out. Figuring out when and where to use Toxicon II in order to not lose dps to mobility and open mini burst heal windows is a good optimization mechanic. The current balance (from all the encounters we've seen so far) has made it challenging enough and a lot of fun IMO.
If you were to say, straight up remove toxicon II, the sage gameplay would take a serious hit and wouldn't be anywhere as fun to optimize. So it isn't just useless button bloat. It would be exactly in the same vein as how shifting SCH over to a 2.5s cast ruined the entire optimization cycle of SCH and made the class even more boring to play than it already was.